Well I figger that my 2WD X is better than any of y'alls cuz it is 2WD on the left side only!

Yeah thats rite - LF & LR drive - goes like boogers on speed around those right-hand corners, but it shore do suck arse on the lefties!

Next time I will go for the optional fully floating defribulator valve! I think that outta cure it!

over here horse...time for your annual beating!

Annual? Try weekly.

Here's a simple comparison...

Rockcrawler, (on a rock). 44" tires, Dana 60's, locked, 200:1 crawl ratio 1000+ RTI at 30 degrees.



SUV, 32" tires, stock axles, 33:1 crawl ratio, 700 RTI at 20 degrees.



There is a huge difference, and yes, someday, maybe someone will take a SawZall and cut up a $25,000 Xterra, replace everything on it and make a rockcrawler.
A person with a clue however would buy a 1985 Toyota and start from there instead.

I don't usually post to these 2WD versus 4WD arguments. I believe that everyone buys what they buy for a reason. I will point out that even though my Xterra will never be a true "rock crawler" I do drive very slow(crawl)over large rocks. I really like all the 2WD folks I've met so far and am happy that they are here. The more the merrier. I think the reason that some 4WD people rag on them is two fold:
1) They enjoy the feeling of superiority they get when they put a similar truck ,with what they consider inferior ability, down.
2) They worry that a 2WD truck in the group will make them unable to go where they want to go.

I was one of the people that stated that they purchased their vehicle for "hard core off roading and rock crawling". In comparison to what the majority of XOC members do, what I do is hard core off roading and rock crawling. In comparison to the type of vehicle represented in Ian's first photo, what I do is a Sunday drive in the park. I assumed that the survey meant in comparison with other XOC members or people that buy SUV's in general. I wanted a Jeep Wrangler that I could modify over the years until I couldn't drive it on the road anymore. My wife insisted on a SUV. I compromised. I'm much happier than I thought I would be. One last point; several 2WD owners have traded in for 4WD, has anyone gone the other way around?

Don't let them bother you Todrick, I enjoy using my winch.

Xterrian,

Your post was right on the mark, IMO. I find it interesting that listers insist on pointing out irrelevant details. A debate or lecture on what rock crawling is, for instance, doesn't belong here.

Extreme uses were used to illustrate the point that there is a wide variety of interests that motivate one's desire for a vehicle. Most of us, in the general population...not just on this list, are in the middle of the spectrum when it comes to what we use our X's for most frequently and why we bought it in the first place.

If this is a "trail riding" or "four wheeling" list, then change the statement on the homepage or change the name. I, for one, joined because I saw what looked like an interesting forum for X owners. I didn't expect to be made to feel badly because my Xterra is a 4X2. I did my research before buying what I wanted, from a wide variety of vehicles, and bought what I wanted.

I would like to see more DIY threads on mechanics that don't involve suspension, etc (that are specific to 4 wheelin') and more on the things so many advise just bringing to the dealer to fix. I understand that the X is so new that most are still under warranty, but I hope to stick around as time goes by so that I can benefit from those threads. It will save money, in labor etc, and benefit ALL Xterra owners.

Do many listers have service manuals? How 'bout the Haynes manual? I have one on order and hope to use it for routine maintenance or possibly more involved repairs. I enjoy it and find it interesting. I also understand that there will be many I can't, because I don't have the tools. But, I'll deal with that then!

Anyway....

See ya'

I agree w/ Xterrian 100%.

I also agree w/ Ian's last post. The term "rock crawler" is used wrong in this 4WD vs 2WD debate. I always think of the hacked up trucks when talking about rock crawling.

The Xterra may never be at the level of those true rock crawlers, but I have a huge amount of respect for the men and women on this board that have gone over and up some impressive obstacles w/ their Xs. Both 4WD and 2WD!

A agree w/ you SoCal. Which is why I said I think the term "rock crawling" is being mis-used. Anyone who's using it to define their X's offroad ability is mis-using it.

Once again, a 4x4 X can go over some nice size rocks in stock form, but once modified slightly it is pretty impressive for a SUV. Maybe my standard of what's "impressive" is skewed since I'm a Road Racer at heart.

I am looking forward to Todrick's X being finished. I would like to see if he can build up the X to do what he wants. I just don't understand why you guys lets the little "4x2s are big station wagons" comments get to you. If your secure in your purchase let the comments roll off your back.

OK, why does it seem I only imagined SocalX posted something?

No one is trying to make anyone feel bad.
I'm just trying to stop the misinformation that a 2WD is anywhere near as capable as a 4WD so people interested in buying an Xterra, who read this board for advice, are not led in the wrong direction.

I deleted it. Any time I respond all it does is continue the debate and as I said earlier , this can never come to a resolution.

You know I think I made some of the following comments in a post a while back but I can't find it so here I go:

I'm a 2wd X owner. I was driving an Altima that was coming up to the 80,000 mile mark and started looking for another vehicle. Was really getting sick and tired of being yet just another person in a 4 door sedan out in the world. I also have two kids and wanted something a little bigger that I could carry more crap in without stuffing it in the trunk.

I had allways liked the X for it's looks and I've allways had pretty good luck with Nissan cars. I looked into a GC but everytime I convinced myself that reliability wasn't as bad as it seems I would see 500 of them on the way to or from work and decided that I didn't want to be yet another drone. I then thought about a Yukon or a Tahoe . But then it hit me : they're made by Chevrolet and Chevrolet pretty much sucks.

Which brings us back to the X. The size I need in a stylish , love it or hate it package. I took a test drive and was hooked. It also didn't hurt that I can purchase a Nissan under the VPP program and paid $500 under invoice with an additional $500 dollar rebate and 3.9% financing.

When It came time to decide on the model I wanted I didn't even consider a 4x4. I'd never had one. Never needed one. Never even wanted one . I was buying a nice tall family vehicle with ample power and the room I needed and I was happy. I opted for the SE model because I actually like having a leather steering wheel and the little titanium accents dressed it up a little, made it a little more unique. I liked that it had a sunroof. Understand , I smoke and it sucks having your windows open in the rain or cold to let the smoke out. ( I never smoked with the kids in the vehicle). It just so happens that I have never smoked in the X because I didn't want it to smell like smoke or risk cigarette burns.

I drove of the lot with my black SE and I felt that I had made a wise purchase . The price I wanted , reliability I expect and styling that set it apart.

Keep in mind . Commercials are just advertising to portray an immage and it really wasn't my inspiration in my purchase descision. The off-road thing didn't even weigh into my descision. Not until I popped on to the XOC did I even begin to realize that there was more to it than my basic needs for purchase. I've since done some light modifications to my truck , not only to make it better and more comfortable on road , but a bit more capable off road.

I've taken it on a few trails and had a damn good time doing it. I have a new hobby. One that I had not even invisioned when I made my purchase. Now I'm going to make the most out of what I have. I'm pretty sure , if Nissan doesn't screw with the design too much there will be more and more aftermarket support.

I am an automobile enthusiast. I allways have been . Shit , a friend of mine left me his Porche all week and I'm like a little kid in a candy store. Just excited to be behind the wheel of something fun and different is cool. But I am now an X enthusiast. For better or for worse. 2wd and all. That is where my energy and passion for vehicles is focused. I've found my X to be a quite capable vehicle for my needs. It has met them and exceeded them far beyond my expecations of what I had percieved my X ownership would be.

I credit my 2wd minivan/station wagon as well as the XOC for introducing me to the exciting world of offroading. I hope , along with the rest of you , to continue to seek the limits of my truck's capability and seek out new ways to help it exceed those limits and raise the bar of it's performance.

thanks man

Me Too!

Hey Todrick, where are you at with your buildup you've been talking about? If you've been waiting all this time for SLR's long travel stuff, I hope you've been saving alot of $$$$$.

All this talk about 2wd vs 4wd is rediculous.
Some of you have even referred to a 2wd Xterra as a station wagon, well ok so your idea of a station wagon is just a bit different then most of us. What I really can't understand is this macho gotta have a 4wd vechile attitude. I have lived here in MD for 20+ years and very rarely ever had a need to use 4wd. I don't get my kicks by taking my $20,000+ vehicle off road were it could get torn up. If I wanted to do this I would buy a beater Jeep and beat it up some more and not care about it. I don't have the need to drive my truck around with lights all over it and a winch on the front bumper just so I can use it a few times a month to head out on some trail. If I worked for the forest service or maybe construction were I needed frequently I would have gotten one with 4wd. See not all of us are trail runners. Some of us just like the Xterra for it's looks and for it's utility features and that's it, end of story. There is no way most resonable people are gonna believe that a 2wd is nearly as capable as a 4wd in offroad situations. Only a fool would follow a 4wd drive thru a mud hole or up some big hill with a 2wd thinking he could keep up. I don't give a rats butt how good your driving skills are, when the traction/control goes so do you. I have had my Xterra off-asphalt on some fire trails which were a bit more challaging then I expected. Frankly I am pretty amazed at how capable the truck is. But, I know my limits with 2wd.

Let the flames begin!!!!!!!!

But that is exactly why this debate continues. Quite a few people on XOC believe this fallacy, and continue to post topics about it.

I don't care what people drive, but when 2WD owners claim that their 2WD is capable off-road, then we have to step in and set them straight.

Just a thought here, but if it were not for 4WDs, where would that beater 4WD Jeep come from in your scenario ?

Ian, I just can't bring myself to beat up my daily drive. I love this truck and off roading
with it scares the hell outta me. If I had a beater truck then I would'nt care if I trashed it even further.

Ekh.

Todrick is the only one going on about it.
Jackal rarely speaks (on XOC) about his 2WD--he just drives it up the fuckin' trail.
SocalpunX has some thoughts on the issue, too, but Todrick is really the only one who argues the off-road strengths of an Xterra (I'm the first to tell you my X will never see more than an overgrown driveway . . . )

Quote:

I don't care what people drive, but when 2WD owners claim that their 2WD is capable off-road, then we have to step in and set them straight.

Why? It's only adding fuel to a fight you are having with one man.
The rest of the 2WDers don't really give a shit what you can do with your truck, we're just tired (I am, anyway) of listening to the holier-than-thou crap.
I think part of the problem is anyone's definition of "off-road". For you, it's much more a rugged, rock-strewn, Moab-based adventure. To me, off-road is getting to a good camping spot at KOA. Maybe there needs to be some kind of baseline definition of "off-road" before you bitch-slap each other any more over "off-road" abilities . . .

Quote:

Just a thought here, but if it were not for 4WDs, where would that beater 4WD Jeep come from in your scenario ?

Good point.
In twenty years, I'll pick up a beater Xterra for next to nothing, and beat the crap out of it on the trails for awhile, too. In the meantime, the new, sweet, $23K truck gets bathed and waxed regularly, and is not abused.

i am still waiting on his kit.

mainly because the only other option would be a custom fab'ed kit that would cost a hell of a lot more(based on the "were not releasing pricing info but somewhere around $#,###" figures from SLR)

we'll see... also this job market is killing me... i am working on a barter with a custom shop... but the owner is a busy guy and i have not spoke with him in a couple weeks... that may be the route i go

Xterra_Canuk,

Are there any good camping site(s) at KOA?????

I don't agree with the abused part of the post.

I don't think off-roading with an X is considered abuse, just vehicle/human testing.

Ekh.

i really dont, i know this whole debate started two years becasue of my statement "a 4x2 x with a good driver can go where a 4x4 x with a novice driver cant..." i still believe that is true... but not just cause of ability... also because of confidence...

dont believe me, ask Imacsae, if his truck would have went up Box canyon in AZ following jackel, if he wouldn't have had me driving it. after following jackel up the toughest obstacle he even said "i would have turned around"... this was a case of it being more about the driver and less about the vehicle... cause now ivan goes places that scare the crap outta me

but believe what you want. i have and always will know that all things being equal a 4x4 is more capable than a 4x2... only a complete moron does not know that.

but now the debate is not even about that, it seems to be more about trying to convince people i am the one who starts this fight... when in reality i just want to go out and have a good time with fellow x owners who dont care whether we have 4x2's or 4x4's

My apologies, Todrick, I didn't mean to come off sounding like I was criticizing you.

My only intention was to note that the whole 2WD vs. 4WD debate seems to have two combatants only: Todrick versus 4WDers.

I appreciate your arguments, and I have never heard you say that a 2WD can go someplace it can't. Every time I've seen you post about a 2WD's capability, it's after you or Jackel have proven it.

Good luck in the future taking your X places it shouldn't be able to go, and proving nay-sayers wrong.

Happy wheeling.

Prob'ly not. Just making a point about the limits where I will subject my truck to off-roading. I've never done KOA--just being facetious.

Quote:

I don't agree with the abused part of the post.
I don't think off-roading with an X is considered abuse, just vehicle/human testing.

Quite right.
I apologize, I'm sure no one abuses their Xterras off-road. I prob'ly would, though, as I would be considered a novice driver.

Wait, I take it back--I saw Chia's rig up close Saturday. Okay, everyone but Chia does not abuse their Xterras off-road . . .

Except for me...maybe...... :rolleyes: