Reply here if you care to on my post.
Cord

Chris drove across fragile cryptobiotic soil, cactus and yucca, killing it or damaging it. He admitted to doing so, claiming it was a seldom used trail. He admitted driving around people (us and a group of Jeeps) because everyone was holding him up. He cut in front of many trucks just so he could put his truck in Mickey's Hot tub.

I don't care how well known he is in the sport, he broke the rules of Tread Lightly, and was rude on the trail.

Just because you all look up to him, doesn't mean I can't look down on him for what he did.

I could care less what the 4 wheeling community thinks of me, because I care very little for them. We get constant shit from everyone because we happen to drive Xterras where people like you think you're only allowed, or capable of going.

I was motorcycling in Moab before you were born. I don't want to see it (or any trails) get closed because people like Chris (and you obviously) don't think rules apply to them.

I have no reason to look up to Chris. I drive a Jeep not a Toy. As far as rigs and wheelin' go I'm in a diverse club, not a jeep club. We do all kinds of wheeling. We have an Amigo in the club that I think is badass. I like Xterra's too. I'd like to see more on the CO trails.

Tread lightly....hmmm yeah I must not care since I'm the Land Use Officer for our club.

I was just giving my opinion on how you come across man thats all.
Cord

Everyone here knows I'm an asshole, but I'm the nicest asshole you'll meet.

I spend 4 hours a day administering this site, and hundreds of hours a year preparing and running events like GOX and goneMOAB. I do my share, and sometimes I have bad days. "quite a few posts" out of 5300 does not make me an bad person.

We have rules here, just like on the trails, if they get broken, I enforce them.

LMFAO! I'm not attacking you man. The whole thing with Chris is just opinion without proof. Yes he said it was a uncommenly used trail. Knowing Chris that is good enough for me.

Then how about everyone who saw him do it reply to this thread ?

Better yet...have them reply in co4x4.org so everyone will know he did it. Just make sure they know it was not a section of trail and that he indeed was breaking trail.

Well I would call crushing 6 to 9 inch tall brush with his front passenger side tire "breaking trail" .

See this is what I'm talking about. This is the 1st anyone has mentioned that.

I probably was the first person to mention this issue on the XOC website when I saw a picture that included his rig. Branches breaking, sand flying (not rooster tail), etc...

Posted 3/31/02 8:34 p.m. MT So, I would like to clarify, LAXterra was not the first to mention this issue. I got home Sunday evening and posted the reply when I saw a picture of his rig.

Ian took this issue to a larger forum. As a fellow resident of Colorado, I hope that you realize that the environment in Colorado and in Utah a greater different than on the west coast. The trails that we use remain from the founding days of out state. Once damaged, the earth seldom heals.

I am a person who seldom will get mud on my truck while tearing up a puddle of water. Some people I know are not so sensitive.

There is a phase that I have seem that is important to me which basically goes, "we borrow the earth from our children". As a parent, I hope that my son is able to enjoy the public lands as I am now able to do so, but if people (Chris or others) do not see the larger damage/impact to our recreational activity, then most likely the "greenies" as I have seem on other websites will prevail.

As a witness to the senseless destruction of the environment and most likely public lands, he was WRONG! No excuses, no claiming that he thought it was a seldom used trail, nothing, nada, zilch. If there is a BLM officer out there who wants a sworn statement, please email me.

On Friday I saw a group of 8+ trucks all getting tickets near Gemini bridges. Too bad the driver of the yellow Toyota did not get the same.

Later,

Todd

hey D_Roc... i think it is cool that you would post here as well... However... technicly Ian(XOC) is God here.... it is his site, he owns it.

that being said i would have to say i am probably in the top 5 people that piss Ian off... yet im still here, why? because ian does not ban people for having a differing opinion, never has and i assume never will. He will however ban someone who does not own an Xterra, who comes over here with no other intent than to Troll... "McSoo" from PBB comes to mind...

that being said, Ian is a good guy. He coems off harsh, but thats only due to the insane amount of BS the guy has to put up with... only last month he and his family was threatened because someone didnt like his actions... but guess what... even that guy is still here... why? because Ian is also fair, he always seems willing to geive people the benefit of the doubt, and quite often a second chance. If this whole incident is ruining Ian reputation, that is very sad, hes a good guy who is a supporter of tread lightly and he has done more for the Xterra Community than almost anyone else... from where i sit, Chris should be a man and admit what he did was wrong, there were tons of whitnesses and at least if he admited it was wrong and appologized he would be a humble person who made a mistake... not an arogant Asshole who made a mistake.

just my .02

Just keep chewing the nicorette .

Very good Snoopy!

Ian,
Quick break into the first aid bag. I remember a care package.

Congratulations on your efforts.

Todd

I wasn't at the trail so I'm not an eyewitness, but that night I did feel the anger when we caught a glimpse of the Yellow Toy in one of the pictures. Eveyrbody went off about he shouldn't be allowed on the trails for driving all over the place like he did, so I assume the damage he caused was quite severe.

Plus I personally know all of the people who were there and know that they wouldn't think of blameing Chris just out of spite.
All of us who were there wouldn't really care what another 4-wheeler thought about us, we were just there to enjoy ourselves. We catch alot of flak for driving Xterras offroad so we have learned to ignore other drivers crude comments.

Having grown up going to Moab since I was an infant I'm a "greenie" when it comes to protecting that area.
If forced to choose between locking the whole area down or letting Tread Lightly violations go unpunished I'd close Moab up.
So my opinion is if 6-8 eyewitnesses can prove what happened as well as a picture then throw the book at Chris.
No matter what his reputation is Moab is sacred to me, and nothing is as much of a crime in Moab then going off trail.

Better yet...CONTACT ONE
Cord

Since you asked…

On the date of 3/26 I witnessed the mentioned yellow-tubed Toyota on the Hells’ Revenge trail driving rudely and off the trail more than once. I witnessed this vehicle pass/cut in front of others at least twice without regard, one time by completely going off the trail and driving over/on anything in the way.

At the Escalator the driver seemed to be going out of the way to take a different line/climb more/different rock than everybody else. When this driver exited the escalator he backtracked a bit then circled around the main trail on the back side and proceeded to drive over sand, bushes, pinon, small rocks, and fragile soil on terrain that wasn’t marked as a trail or ever appeared to be one to pass the group that was queued up for Tip Over. This was/is not a seldom-used trail by any stretch and I looked it over at a distance because I didn’t even want to risk walking in there. Furthermore, it makes absolutely no sense that a trail spur would ever have been created at this spot with the floral & rock outcroppings blocking access and the fact there is plenty of room on the main trail.

I don’t know anything about the driver/vehicle other than what I witnessed that day. Based on that experience alone I would say that this person violated the tread lightly principals repeatedly, was rude to others on the trail, acted very selfish/ irresponsible, drove at a speed that appeared to be way more than was necessary especially just before the tip over challenge, and was only concerned with their agenda.

wow... doesn't get much clearer than that

Sounds like someone needs to post that statement by Xtoolbox over in that other forum. That thread keeps on rolling over there and they aren't getting any "witnesses".

Don't waste your energy. Spend it on more quality stuff like:

Why don't you chicken shit get off you ass, sign up for an account, and post this where the people directly involved can respond to your accusations? Cord

Oh hahahahaha Your too clever. point??????XOC started this mess. All I am sayingis "don't sing it, bring it". PERIOD. Confront him or shut the fuck up! Don't care it I get banned from this board or not. You get my Point! PERIOD!

Why can't Chris get off his ass, sign up for an account, and post this here where the people directly involved hang out so he can defend himself?

Seems to me that it would be easier for one person to come over here than 8 people go over there.

I mean he might as well, it seems half of the rest of the offroading community has accounts here.

Didn't XOC already do that on the colorado4x4 board?
And didn't he admit that he was bypassing people by going off the trail?

Hay D_Roc,

D_Roc,

Basically, If he would have stood up and admitted guilt, most of this would not be an issue. But no, his "rep" was too high. Since you appear to be in Colorado, check out today's Denver Post series on the behavior and reputation of various ministers.

They should know better as should Chris G. There are rules by which we should follow while 4-wheeling; he did not. I am not equating his actions to those involved with victimizing children, but no one has a reputation that is beyond reproach.

If Chris is a man, he will admit his actions were wrong to the people who saw his actions. This is the communications tool which we the witness's utilize. This would be the appropriate forum, XOC, for an apology. I do not delieve that I should go into a forum of non involved people. The issue is well known in your forums. The identity of the individual was requested. We heard who this was. Since that time, a bunch of non-witnesses have butted into this issue, not providing qualitative information, but rather adolescent comments.

The request was to identify the individual who violated the princiles of tread Lightly. This was the desire, but, the awareness of the issue has increased and is no longer between the directly involved people.

If you are a friend of his, pass this message to him. If you do not know him, butt out.

I do not want to see the “crimes” of people cause me to lose tha ability to go 4-wheeling. Maybe Chris should personally organize the restoration of damage done elsewhere by someone who did not adhere to these principles. Maybe then, he would understand how this simple little event can cause longterm, major damage to the environment. But then again, if he is unwilling to make any sort of ammends for his actions, he will stigmatize those who support and condone his actions in Moab.

Unless you can provide qualitative information, (other than little finger pointed in the air), as others here have stated and I concur, GO AWAY. .

Tread Lightly mission statement:

Through Education, Restoration and Research, Tread Lightly Empowers Generations to Enjoy the Outdoors Responsibly

Todd