I'm not sure. It could have something to do with making Paul Lynde the center square on the old "Hollywood Squares" show.

One can find reference to homosexual behavior in the earliest records of societies. It's normal. It's the way it has been since the beginning of time.

In what manner have you shown it to be wrong?

Tim

Let's assume? You've already proved that they have as per your next statement. And that was just in the ten commandments. Second, have you looked at the different versions of the Ten Commandments? They are essentially the same. Different parts - Same meaning.

Hey Tim,

Please show me where, in the beginning of time that is, that homosexuality was normal. I hate to use this, but I think it was Adam and Eve not Adam and Steve.

Speaking of which...look at what THIS ASS CLOWN is up to now.

Homosexuality exists in human's closest animal relatives . . .

Homosexuality exists in the animal kingdom. Unless the animals are just experimenting a little after moving out of their parents' tree . . .

I was thinking Richard Simmons....HEY Let's play Name the Gayest Guy EVER !....

I vote for this guy :

If you really think we all started from two people, I feel sorry for you. Ever heard of inbreeding?

Adam and Eve are just an example.

Yeah Phelps is an idiot and gives Christians a bad name by using his demented brand of faith to condemn others.

Please read and comprehend more carefully. The fact that a certain percentage of our population is homosexual is normal, as it is the way it has been since the beginnning of society.

Reading for you:

Law, society and homosexuality in classical Athens - David Cohen

Translating Greek homosexuality: reticence and the truth of sex - James Davidson

It's fine that you don't think it is normal. It's fine you think it's wrong. You are certainly correct that the bible says it's a sin.

However, this country is great because it is filled with people of many religions, and no religions. Marriage predated christianity. We don't have the right as christians to say everyone's idea of marriage must conform to our's, and certainly not in this country.

You missed commenting on my response to you, but you managed to comment on my response to NY Madman. Interesting.

Tim

You know something.... I think all you people who feel homosexual behavior is normal have something wrong with your thought processes.

You are sick bastards. Just as sick as the deviants.

It's not normal. It is a deviation from the norm. It is a perversion of the norm.

The problem with all this gay shit going on in society is they want to "normalize" homosexuality. They want to "mainstream" it. That's not going to happen.

Anyone who thinks if gays got the right to marry, this will be the end of their demands, you are nothing but an incredible fool.

I don't care about this crap that "I have a gay friend or cousin and they are wonderful people". Maybe they are. Many are not. The gay community is a total depraved and sick corner of society. They have a much higher rate of battery and domestic abuse than the population as a whole. Most of these people are sick and live sick lifestyles. That's the truth even though you may know a few "good" ones.

PackRat is right. No one is ever going to change anyone's mind.

No I haven't. The commandments that DO have laws like them are commandments that AFFECT SOMEONE ELSE. I.E. crime against someone else. Someone else can be hurt by it.

Here's a good quote for you: ""The legitimate powers of government extend to such acts only as are injurious to others." --Thomas Jefferson: Notes on Virginia, 1782. ME 2:221

Here's another: ""Common sense [is] the foundation of all authorities, of the laws themselves, and of their construction." --Thomas Jefferson: Batture at New Orleans, 1812. ME 18:92"

(yep...sure see "christian" or "religion" or "judeo-christian" in THAT sentence. :rolleyes:

Quote:

Second, have you looked at the different versions of the Ten Commandments? They are essentially the same. Different parts - Same meaning.

Yes I have. And they are still different. Show me where in the Protestant and Catholic commandments there is anything like the Hebrew's first commandment: "I am the Lord thy God, who brought thee out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of slavery."

I like this discussion of the Ten Commandments:

http://www.geocities.com/bobmelzer/gc10cx.html

From Wordiq.com:
In sociology, norm is a technical term describing the expected pattern of behavior in a given situation, the custom.

As homosexuality has been ever present in society, the fact that it is present now is the norm. It would be abnormal if it wasn't present. This isn't a difficult concept if you aren't angry and you mind is thinking clearly.

How are you so tapped in to what "THEY" want?

Really? Where did you find that info?

No, that's not the truth. That is your sad little opinion about something you have little knowledge of, and much anger about. Nothing but opinion.

No, but hopefully POV such as yours will be exposed for being the hatred filled, unfounded, spew that it is.

Tim

"Do it like they do on the Discovery Channel."

Most animals engage in "deviant" behaviour. People are animals. Get over it.

Not that I think this is deviant behaviour, mind you. Hence the quotes.

That's the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard.

Pedophilia and incest are present in society. Always have been. People have always committed bestiality. Is that the norm.

Your argument is wrong. If homosexuality is to be considered a societal norm, every other form of deviant behavior by default is also normal. According to your twisted logic.

I was a cop for 11 years. Every big city cop who has a gay area in his precinct or patrol sector knows this.

That's another thing that your side always claims. "Everyone who does not approve of the homosexuals is filled with hate". That's bullshit. You only say that to shut down the debate. It's not working.

I know what Kalevipoeg is about, man I just was wandered why you talking about myths, while there is about only thing existing.

Not to mention that Roman empire and Ancient Greece are wee bit older than that, and they had notion of marriage as well Heck even older - Egypt and Messpotamia did too..
So it just struck me that someone talking about not very well known country with even less known myths&legends... Not many people in states even heard about it. Even less familiar with it mythology.

Why is this so hard for you to understand?

You are talking about whether or not something that involves a small percentage of the population is normal. Of course it isn't. It isn't normal to be a redhead, either.

I'm saying, if society has always had say, 10% redheads, it would be ridiculous to say having no redheads is normal.

Tim

Okay, so no empirical evidence. Simply your interpretation.

Tim

Yes it is normal to be a redhead. That is an inherited genetic trait. It is not behavior.

You use very twisted logic pal.

It also seems in your statement you are agreeing with me that gays are not normal.

Please tell me you kidding. You never actually did read Illiada? Comedy of Lisistrata? Same sex relationships were quite widely practiced in Greece, Roman Empire (which somewhat inherited it from Greece). Those were crib of modern Western civilization per se. Mongolians, however used to punish it by death.

In society, it is not normal to be a redhead. It is normal for a society to have redheads. Normal has a very specific meaning.

Tim

Sorry Tim. I didn't know you wanted a response from me on this. I believe it is very difficult and many times impossible for marriage to exist without God in the relationship. Feel free to do the math on this. What are the divorce statistics these days? I think it's more than half of all marriages end in divorce. I've also got another stat for you. Less than 1% of all marriages where couples pray together end in divorce (stat from Tommy Nelson's book The Book Of Romance: What Solomon Says About Love, Sex and Intimacy)

Marriage to me is a sacrament- defined as a sacred moment. Plus, I appreciate the linguistics lesson on where the word marriage comes from. The fact of the matter is marriage cannot exist without guidelines. I believe that I must follow the guidelines passed down through history and written down in text in the Bible. I don't believe I have ever once told you or someone else how to live. Forgive me if I have. You are right about the fact that there are Christians who find it easier to tell other people how to live, than to follow the path of Christ themselves. I am sure there are also many others guilty of this besides Christians. By the way this is also mentioned in scripture from Matthew as a direct quote from teachings of Jesus.

Abnormal has a very specific meaning.

Homosexual deviant behavior = Abnormal.

There is no use in keeping up the conversation. Your logic is flawed.

Moby,

Seems like a much more practical theory than any others in my opinion.