DBAX does that thing come with a leather option? I bet that thing would be a blast!

Wow, so you've taken your '05 Xterra on trails no fully locked FJ80 would dare to go?
Now THAT'S hardcore!

:rolleyes:

I own a 05 Rubicon and wheel with a guy with a 2002 supercharged X all the time.

I like the X, and it has a huge advantage in interior space. He lugs the cooler.

It is also capable off road, but could use lockers. I had to pull him up a section of trail, on one outing. (could have been my bad spotting)

He may trade his in on a Rubicon or Rubicon unlimited.

I know tons of people with Jeeps, and none have had major problems. My buddies X had the AC go out 6 months after he got it.

Toyota "legendary reliability" is just that, a legend, a grain of truth with a ton of hype. My mom has a 2000 Camry and it is a POS, the strut towers went bad at 28k and Toyota would not cover them under warranty. At least not until my mother wrote a nasty letter to the corporate offices, and even then they would not cover the shocks that failed because the strut towers did.

Another Buddy has a 99 Tacoma and it is falling apart. I can’t stand it, it is such a pile of crap. Warped rotors, really bad axle wrap on every stop, interior trim falling off.Also had the starter go with less the 80k on it and the ignition switch. Totally reminds me of 80s GM cars.

I have owned 3 2000 and newer GM vehicles and everyone has been better then those "legendary Toyotas".

I am sure you will love the X, they are pretty cool, and I don't have a wife and kids, and don’t plan on getting any kids ever. So the jeep is fine for me, the dog, and any future chicks I decide to put up with.

The people here who said the X is a better all around vehicle are on target, but it won't keep up with a wrangler, and especially a Rubicon on some trails.

Own them on dunes though!

It all boils down to driving what you like. I think the Jeeps are way cooler looking but that’s just me.

Oh check with your dealer before you do major mods, they may mess with your warranty on you.

With Modern cars, I don’t think reliability is much of a factor, they ALL are, even Toyotas and Chryslers, they all put out a lemon now and then but quality is pretty close across the board. The age of all American cars being crap was over YEARS ago.

AS an example both Ford and Toyota just recalled hundreds of thousands of vehicles.

One word: statistics.

Hey, I am perfectly willing to admit the people I know got unlucky.

But I know they had problems.

I didn’t really want to bag on Toyotas.

Just to say they are not problem free.

My whole point was drive what you like.

Yeah, and as much of a Toyota fanatic as I am, I still am willing to admit when I see a Rubicon, my pants get a little tight. The Rubicon is my Pam Anderson; I don't want to like her, I just kinda can't help it.

The stats no longer favor Toyota.

Apparently, you didn't get the memo.


Seriously, though. I would never down Toyotas because they are good vehicles.

Your rig is nice, but will have some fairly significant trouble getting through some local spots I frequent. The 90s LCs are just big. I'm sure there are plenty of places it isn't an issue, but at Old Chinaman's, Eagle Rock, Devil's Punchbowl and plenty of other places here it can pose a significant liability.

I think the VQ & VG engines and the H233B axle are reason enough for you not to have such an elitist attitude towards Nissan.

Those rhinos look a little funky for my taste; need a bit more room for the big head and kids. A 4 seat buggy with an ice chest rack would be sweet though.

I dunno about LC FJ80's being too large but 40’s are a nice equalizer http://www.actionjackson.com/cruiser/trailruns.asp

Unless you're comparing a FJ80 to a SWB they will go just about anywhere other non choped street legal built 100-115’ LWB’s with sheet metal will. Even a very mild build like mine with just sliders, 2.5” lift, 33’s or 35’s, dual factory lockers can run almost all the trails other than the more extreme stuff

Maybe I’ll chop mine up one of these days so I fit

They're great trail rigs, like I said. They are full sized trucks, though. They will only go where they can fit. I have personally seen FJ80s end up with body damage and have significant trouble where the smaller rigs drove right through.

I'm willing to admit the disadvantages of an Xterra when compared with a SWB. However, we have advantages, too. SWB are more likely to flip backwards on steep obstacles.

A popular mod for Jeep-based rock buggies is to lengthen the wheelbase to ~103". They do it because they want the advantages the extra wheelbase gives.

Congratulations! Enjoy the trails!

I have to agree with that. There are at least three different offroad markets there, probably more. The wrangler-type is for those that JUST go offroad. There's a market for the dual-use off and on-road for the daily drivers, and then there are the soccer moms that sometimes go on dirt roads.

For the daily driver that wants to rock climb, I would see the Liberty in the same group as the xterra, along with the pathfinder and others.

Before throwing out the Jeep Liberty, let me post a little bit about it. I researched a lot of vehicles before I went with a Liberty (and I really love the look of the new Xterras).

#1, the Jeep Liberty *IS* a capable offroad vehicle. Right off the lot, you can get skid plates, rock rails, and lamp covers for the rear. They aren't just wimpy factory skid plates, either, there's an engine plate, tranny plate, tank skid, etc - it's fully covered down there, I've bounced off a lot of rocks.

#2, Lots of aftermarket parts available. 2-3" lift kits (spacer or spring) are available from multiple vendors (I'd guess at least 20 manufacturers). As cheap as $130 for a spacer, full coil lifts are as cheap as $500.

#3, Other available aftermarket parts - lockers, differential plates, bumpers/winches, other typical 4x4 accessories.

#4, bigger than a wrangler! Lots of space inside to fit people + stuff, and it has 4 doors! I would have gotten a wrangler myself if there were 4 doors and cargo space.

#5, The lightbar you can get installed by the dealer. Sure there are plenty of aftermarket ones available, but the factory one looks nice.

#6, Despite being larger than the wrangler, it has a very tight turning radius and godo visibility. I find that it's easier to drive on trail and on road than cars are. Who wouldn't want a truck like that that can still parallel park and do a u-turn within 2 lanes?

In the Jeep world, the Liberty is still trying to gain acceptance - The main reason it's not seen as truly offroad capable is because of the independant front suspension - however ONLY the wrangler is SFA now, both the cherokee and the commander are independant, so it is the direction these vehicles are moving.

Not really trying to say Xterra vs Liberty pros/cons, but it is another vehicle you should consider if not sure what to get. Check out the Liberty owners club, "LOST" at www.lostkjs.com to see the similar kind of information on wheeling and vehicle comparisons. (and great photos).

Liberty is around the same price point, too, I believe. I got my renegade loaded for around 24, but I had a lot of discounts, I think the sticker put it close to 30. (you can get them as low as 16 I think if you want previous year bare)

Good luck on the purchase!

(also - are there any trail-ride groups around the new england area? PM me if you ride, I'm always looking for more groups and trails to ride)

This is the best most productive thread Ive read so far since I started looking around to beef up my 03 X. Rock on.

Actually, most Jeep owners (much like most Xterra owners) around here are posers who never go offroad. I asked a local Jeep owner if he had ever been up Gold Camp Rd (graded & improved dirt road suitable for an Accord). He said "Hell no, I'm still making payments on this thing!"

So I guess the average person would just be comparing a 4-door to a two-door grocery getter.

very good last point. i definitely will be in the grocery getting category for a good while. i don't care either. i'd like to armor it up first (which will take a bit). i'm content with my choice. this truck is badass.

what the hell is the deal with folks worrying about the percentages of females buying xterras? makes me feel good. damn. girls have GOOD tastes in looks.. this is obvious. and besides that... who gives a crap??? the xterra looks like a killer, it's powerful as hell... HIGHLY offroad capable (even right off the lot), and ... they're just badass like i said. i'd still buy it if i were the only male to ever buy one.

roll xterra roll.

Well, not all Jeep owners are posers. Until this past week, I was a proud owner of a 2004 Jeep Wrangler Sahara.









I towed mine with my motorhome. It was easy to modify for this feature... and was designed to be towed (just read the owners manual for details).

I've had mine in water up to the edge of the hood. No mods at that point. The only upgrade I did later was to swap the Goodyears for Goodrich (major difference).

For serious off-road ability, my Wrangler was a much better choice than an Xterra, sorry. That's the truth. Both mine and the Rubicon use 4-11 gears. The Rubicon added lockers, and would flat leave even a highly modified X behind. Look at the difference in weight. If you don't think an extra 1000 lbs will slow you down going through mud, well, you've probably never really been in it. I swear my Jeep thought it could swim through swamps.

If you're looking for one of the most capable vehicles for off-road use, and the most supported vehicle by the aftermarket, then the Rubicon is an easy choice.

That said... I no longer own my Jeep. Why? Well, a number of reasons. Fuel economy was terrible. Never got higher than 15 MPG. HWY, city, hard top, soft top, no top, A/C on, A/C off. The 4.0L had plenty of power. But once on the hwy, it would step into O/D, and have no power. Too big of an O/D gear. Touch the throttle, it would jump out of O/D, and go like hell. But once in O/D, it was a dog again.

The newer coil suspension was much smoother than earlier models. This also increased articulation. The iron inline 4.0L is as tough as they come. Well proven. My aunt has over 300K on her Jeep, still going strong. In the year I had mine, I put 32K on it. Not a single problem.

Stock Wranglers make it through the Rubicon trail. That silly "Trail Rated" badge isn't fluff. Open the hood, climb underneath. You won't find glitz on these. Just big, clunky, hard working parts. Comes stock with Dana Axles for a reason.

I like going off-roading. But I don't go as hardcore as the Jeep was capable. It was more vehicle than I needed. I think the X is a nice blend of a very capable off-road vehicle, and a very nice hwy vehicle. Kind of the best of both worlds. Yes, the X will go some amazing places and do some amazing things. That's one of the reasons I bought mine. But even the full up version of the 4WD model isn't in the same category as a Rubicon Jeep. It isn't meant to be. Completely different market.

Chances are, if you haven't been off-roading for years, you'll likely never use either vehicle to it's limits anytime soon.

As for Jeep owners being posers. I'm sure some are. The first week I owned mine, I left permanent scars in the paint from going down narrow trails, and mud & water up to the tops of the fenders... Love my X though

First off, welcome to the forum, n00b.


Secondly, I won't disagree about your statement about jeeps being more capable out of the box, especially, Rubis.

Jeeps do have some liabilities that I, for one, don't like.

Jeep: Dana 30/35 combo ====> shit
My Xterra: IFS (front)/ 33 spline, 4.90 9.25" R&P STOCK!

Jeep: Cheapo steering that breaks all the time (even in the rubis)
Xterra: Cheapo steering that breaks all the time

Jeep: Needs lift or spacers to fit 32" tires
Xterra: Fits 32's stock

Jeep: Short wheelbase, sometimes an advantage
Xterra: Medium wheelbase, sometimes an advantage

As somebody who wheels frequently, I can tell you that Jeeps break all the time. I see broken Jeeps about 1/4 times I run a difficult trail. I've pulled stuck Jeeps out of jams as have other Xterra owners.

Your opinion is a popular one, but I love my X. Once I put my D44 in front (& 35s all around), a rubicon will just be another "stocker" to me.......



Like I said, welcome to the forum. But spare me the elitist Jeep bullsh!t.......

.

While I'm on a tirade, one last thing.....

Trail rated? L-O-L

my thing is.. folks are always saying jeeps are "better" than xterras offroad.. sure.. they are technically "better" offroaders. but i've said this before. in order to find a spot where a jeep is BETTER than an xterra at offroading, here's what will happen.

you leave work. hook up with your Xterra buddy, go hit the trail (perhaps camp or whatnot), go down the trail further (depending on how long the trail is) and you'll both be there side by side of course.. then, the jeep guy goes "HEY, look at the supersmooth rock over there. i think i'm going to go climb that sucker.. the one that your ifs can't handle.. you know, since i'm cool and you're not." to which the Xterra guy replies, "man, i suck so hard. a complete idiot i am. i should have bought the jeep so i could hit that ONE rock that he's hitting. man i'm so jealous. i guess i'll have to console myself with better gas mileage... and about double the storage space i guess. man, i'm even sad about the towing capacity.. that doesn't do much for me. oh, and my interior sux ass compared to the jeep. not to mention the fact that my car is unoriginal and ugly compared to the jeep."

highly modified jeep vs highly modfied xterra is nearly equal badness offroad... save except for the different advantages of wheel bases. SO, they're not that much more capable. certainly not when you sacrifice all of the stuff mentioned above. now, what IS cool are the doors coming off, and the top coming off. that's sweet. although, here in Alabama, that would be murderously hot in any season other than winter.

FWIW, the Rubicon, the Unlimited, and the Rubicon Unlimited, come STANDARD with DANA 44 axles.

Also, the local Jeep Dealership will install lift kits and massive oversized tires, and the package will carry a factory warranty. It's amazing to see a brand new Jeep, already tricked out with lots of aftermarket parts, and have a modified window sticker. Oh, if you would prefer lockers, bigger tires, lift kits, or different axles on ANY Wrangler they sell, you can have the dealer "upgrade" it before you leave the lot. That's Jimmy Vickers (http://jimmievickers.fivestardealers.com/) on Merritt Island FL if you get a wild hair. They have lots of new modified Jeeps on their lot.

By comparison, I'm having a hell of a time even getting a hitch from my dealer for my X. Forget about them offering any real upgrades at a Nissan dealership.

In EVERY major off-road challenge, you'll find some form of a Wrangler. They are so easy to modify, and parts (chassis, bodies, every single piece of running gear, etc.) is only a phone call away. I don't ever remember seeing a single Xterra in any of those challenges.

I love my X, don't get me wrong. It's also a well built, very off road capable machine. But the Wrangler is 1000 lbs lighter, and some serious off road hardware is already included (read the specs for the Rubicon). They are so easy to modify... even a dealer will do it! The Jeep is so waterproof that it has drain plugs in the floor, and is designed to be hosed out. The computer is in a sealed box at the very top of the firewall. Set a garden hose loose in your X, see what happens.

Don't mistake my comments for a knock against the X. It's a completely different beast from the Jeep. You don't see "cute" decals about Nissans for the Jeep for a reason... they aren't in the same class. Out of the box, the Rubicon is a more capable vehicle. Can you modify a stock X to out perform a stock Rubicon? With enough money, sure. Can you also modify the Rubicon even more, yes, and the parts are much more readily available. Would I take my X 4x4 the same places I took my stock Wrangler... no way. I had water up to the tops of the fenders in the Jeep. If water would have made it past the door seals, wouldn't have been an issue in the Jeep.

Enjoy whatcha drive.

Jeep Elitist what? I didn't say anything more than YOU JUST DID!

Haha

Things I don't like so far for using my X offroad (versus, yes, a Jeep): No place to put a high lift jack under a bumper. Unable to install a winch without replacing the entire front bumper. Wussy skid plate up front.

Things I do like about my X for offroading: Good stock ground clearance. Smooth underneath, no obvious snag points. Gobs of power. A real low range. Solid rear axle. Full sized spare tucked underneath. 4 wheel disk brakes. Recovery point up front.

Ain't nothin' perfect. But as an all-around vehicle, the X comes as close as anything I've seen.

For me and my wife the Wrangler was not practical. It's size for one thing is just too damn small. Even the Unlimited was way too small. I ALWAYS have the back end of my X full of work gear that I have to carry incase I need to respond for an emergency. There is no way around it. While a Wrangler would have been nice to have, it just didn't fit my lifestyle other than off-roading.

The lack of cargo space has always been an issue for Wranglers, but being the most widely aftermarket supported vehicle, there are lots of accessories for hanging stuff on top and out back. Just look at the ones often seen on long trail rides. Lots of junk "hanging" on them.

But... sure is nice to have everything inside, dry, and easy to get to.

The Wrangler has a lot of pros and cons. It isn't in the same market with the Xterra. Different class of vehicles. Plastic versus steel bumpers should be the first clue... Besides, there are 3 other (non-Wrangler), bigger models, if you really wanted a Jeep. I like the quality of Nissan, always have.

I just wish Nissan USA would offer a diesel option, as Jeep did for the 2006 Liberty. Betcha we see Nissan coming out with a diesel option for the 2007 models!

I just bought '05 X OR, stick and will have my '02 Wrangler Sport up for sale as soon as the X is rigged to be towed behind my motorhome. Got the Jeep primarily to get me to otherwise inaccesible trail heads. (I hike and backpack.)Also tow the Jeep; but if I had to drive the Jeep on the highway more than 200 miles, I'd park the damn thing beside the highway and hitchhike the rest of the way. Jeep's uncomfortable as hell! And with the Back seat out will hold two full backpacks....barely. I't s single purpose vehicle as far as I'm concerned. X can perform all the functions the Jeep did for me and and do so in lots more comfort.

An Xterra has a steel bumper, too. It's just covered in plastic. (which is almost ripped off mine)

Well that steel bumper won't help when you (in the TJ) have the incredibly weak Dana 30/35 combo. A Rubicon with a lift and upgraded steering is nice, but not just any TJ.

If you spend some time looking around this forum, you will see plenty of pictures of Xterras completing hard-core trails.

If you think Nissans are so inferior offroad I welcome you to attempt obstacles like Cleveland Rock (Holy Cross), Tip-Over challenge (Hell's Revenge), White Knuckle Hill (Pritchett Canyon). All of the listed obstacles have one thing in common. They are extremely difficult for SWB vehicles to conquer. All have been conquered by Nissans.

Like I said, Xterras and Jeeps alike are driven mostly by grocery getters and dirt road drivers. Just because the Xterra happens to be useful doesn't make it as outclassed as you suggest.

IMO the only Wrangler worth considering is the Rubicon Wrangler Unlimited.

Regular Heeps just break too much.

Who said the X was inferior? If I felt that was the case, why would I have purchased $28K worth of X? Duh! Don't get yer knickers in a knot hoss. I tah-ray-ded my Jeep for an X. Money was not an issue, my 05 is paid for. Not to brag, just keeping things in prospective. I also looked at H3s. I did not buy an X to save money! My 04 Jeep was already paid for too. Cost me $9K to get the X.

I've stated nothing but facts. The Wrangler comes with heavy duty steel bumpers. If I still had mine, I'd gladly do a push test against your bumpers, and see who cries first when the plastic starts flying. For any semi-serious off-roading, the plastic has to go. It'll be thrashed in no time, as you've obviously discovered, and it ain't cheap to replace, is it?

The bumper is strong enough for a tow mount so the Jeep can be pulled with another truck, or behind a motorhome (as in my case).

Okay, lets say you start out cheap and decide to buy a Hi-Lift jack instead of a winch. Whatcha gonna put it under to lift your vehicle?

The Jeep was also designed to have handy little gadgets like winches mounted to them. These are bolt-on. The Jeep doesn't require an entire new bumper (made of steel this time) to put a winch on.

In 3' of water, is your altenator underwater? Will your rig survive if the door seal fails? Here's a hint about the Jeep... the stereo faceplate, speakers, and seats are waterproof (well, resistant anyway). The floor has drain plugs.

FWIW, the Rubicon comes with Dana 44 axles. Furthermore, Dana 44 axles, lockers, blah blah can easily be ordered from anyone of of the many companies who support Jeeps. Don't kid yourself. I've owned Nissans since 1995. I know how difficult and limited it is to find aftermarket parts.

Alright, so you decide you don't want a Rubicon, but still want lockers and Dana 44s on a TJ. No problem, these are DEALER ADD-ONs. Jimmy Vickers on Merritt Island will upgrade any of these such items, and give a full trade in on any parts... before you ever roll off the lot. They also come with a full factory warranty. Any of your add ons come with coverage from Nissan? Could they void your warranty?

I'm still trying, I do stress TRYING to get a hitch for my X. Dealer couldn't do it (recall), the aftermarket shop couldn't do it (Valley recalled).

As far as some Xs going on some serious trails, great. Do a search on Google, add a trail of your choice, then add Jeep. You'll see tens of thousands of hits. Seeing an Xterra is more the exception, rather than the rule, unfortunately.

Yes, a long wheelbase is a plus when climbing over some tall obstacles. It's a hinderance on tight trails though. Some buy the Unlimited for the longer wheelbase, some more diehard owners stretch their frames. You won't find any benefit to a longer wheelbase here in Florida. Less weight and wider tires are a big plus.

Love my X, don't get me wrong. It's a very capable vehicle, but even as others have said, the Jeep is more capable out of the box. What I've added, and you must have missed it, is that not only can the X be upgraded, but so can any Jeep. The parts are cheaper, much more available, and easier to install on the Jeep. Sorry if this is tough to accept. Give me your address, I'll start having the many Jeep accessory catalogs sent to your house. I no longer need them, but it might give you an idea of what I'm telling you. You could literally build a Jeep from one of these catalogs (frames, bodies, running gear, wiring, electronics, etc).

Is the Wrangler a better daily driver? No. Does its 4.0L have the power of the Nissan, not even close. Does it have the passenger and cargo room of the X, nope. Does it have anywhere near the fuel economy of the X, no. Are they both capable vehicles, YES. Will most of us EVER push either one to the limits, NOOOO!

I've owned both. Rather than just downplay a vehicle some have never even driven, I'm giving a prospective from experience. I never said the Xterra was incapable of going on any trail, but the question was asked about an X vs a Jeep, presumably out of the box (new).

Xterra probably has the largest (offroad) aftermarket of any SUV currently on the market. If you are having trouble getting stuff, it's because your vehicle hasn't been out a year yet.

I push my X to it's limits all the time, and thank god! Somebody hasta pull out the stuck Jeepers.......

The only reason you don't get stuck is because you think sandy dirt roads is offroading.