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#210581 - 26/07/06 09:15 AM
Re: Lebanon and Israel
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Member
Registered: 17/04/01
Posts: 8849
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Originally posted by FlyFishingX:
ETA: Graham, why did you delete your post? Eh. I read it over a couple times, and wasn't very happy with it. Rather than rewrite, I thought I could back it out without anyone seeing it. I guess it's not that bad. Hey! Who's moderating this stoopid forum? Go ahead and restore my post, please . . . Originally posted by GrayHam, before I deleted it:
To be honest?
I think it might have a bit to do with how the country was born.
The United States [b]fought for their independence.
Canada waited until it was granted independence.
The United States has been attacked, directly, and pulled into war as a result. There is some empathy for what Israel has been through.
Canada has been pulled into war as an obligation as part of the Commonwealth (satellite part of the British Empire, even after "independence"). There is less empathy, as Canadians on the whole have never really experienced what the US and Israel have experienced, at least not in the last 200 years.
I think there is still a culture that says, Hey, chill out, wait it out, everything will be fine.
Of course, that's just an opinion . . . I could be full of shit.[/b]
_________________________
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#210582 - 26/07/06 09:21 AM
Re: Lebanon and Israel
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Originally posted by GrayHam: Originally posted by FlyFishingX:
[b]ETA: Graham, why did you delete your post? Hardly. There has been a lot of stupid shit said in this thread, but I wouldn't rank that post among them.  At least you had an idea, which is saying a lot more than what some people have offered in this thread ....
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#210583 - 26/07/06 06:23 PM
Re: Lebanon and Israel
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Member
Registered: 16/08/00
Posts: 1001
Loc: Oak Ridge, NJ
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Anyone catch the info about someone in Lebanon complaining about Israel using phosporus which BTW is not against any rules of war.
Now on the other hand the Hezbo's fill there Douchbag rockets full of ball bearings to inflict as much collateral damage as possible as well as fight from inside civilian occopied areas...BOTH big no-no's as agreed upon by the civilized world.
I also heard Newt Gingrich speaking about the 2000+ UN troops that have been in the south of Lebanon since the Israel occupation ended and these troops did nothing to stop the Hezbo's or enforce the UN mandate to disarm the Hezbo's.
_________________________
FSRBIKER
97 TJ, 2" lift, 32's
69 Bronco, locked Dana 44, 35" MTR's, 5.5" lift
EOE...Opening Soon!
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#210584 - 26/07/06 07:10 PM
Re: Lebanon and Israel
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Member
Registered: 24/04/03
Posts: 129
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It just didn't suit your agenda to do any explaining. I don't have an agenda here. I'm just concerned of the civillian deaths on both sides. It was interesting that she also wrote about the anti-Israeli/pro-jihadist hate propaganda that is prevalent not only in the Middle East, but also here in the West in institutions such as colleges and universities. I graduated from The University of British Columbia and while there the few odd ball groups protesting Israel's occupation of Gaza and thew West Bank, they were just that: Odd Ball groups. How do you know an IDF soldier wrote that? It was a comment in a blog. It could have been written by anyone, anywhere in the world. Or he did actually write it. Right? Now if you know for a fact that he didn't then I'll agree with you. Considering the fact that Hezbollah, Hamas and the leaders of Iran are NOT reasonable, the likelihood of any lasting peace is a pipe dream of fools. No I don't think we should dimish the possibility. I think peace can be achievable even in this age and in this region. Through more intense negotiation and addressing greivances and concerns on both sides we can achieve it. I'm an incurable optimist. The goal of terrorists is not peace. What is shameful and pathetic is that you don't realize that fact. I'm aware of that. But you must also be aware that you label these people as terrorists and others label them as freedom fighters. It all depends on what side of the issue you support. I think SE4X4 has said it best: This seems wrong to me… this war could spread and no good can possibly come out of it – unless you consider millions of Lebanese and Israelis dead after the end of it a good thing? I am concerned about that. And nothing good is coming out this. I'm hoping there will be peace. And I know it seems to be a pipe dream. Dare to dream, though. 
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#210585 - 27/07/06 05:35 AM
Re: Lebanon and Israel
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Member
Registered: 09/10/02
Posts: 1669
Loc: Austin Texas
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OK since you guys don't like my Hitler quotes how about one from the other side of the coin.
The realization that another person wishes to harm and hurt you cannot undermine genuine compassion—a compassion based on the clear recognition of that person as someone who has the natural and instinctual desire to seek happiness and overcome suffering, just like oneself.
-His Holiness the Dalai Lama
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#210587 - 27/07/06 10:22 AM
Re: Lebanon and Israel
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Member
Registered: 09/10/02
Posts: 1669
Loc: Austin Texas
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Fuck Isreal, they stole the Palestinians land and should get run out.
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#210588 - 27/07/06 10:45 AM
Re: Lebanon and Israel
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Time for the Crusades - the sequel.
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#210589 - 27/07/06 11:11 AM
Re: Lebanon and Israel
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Member
Registered: 09/05/02
Posts: 5232
Loc: Florida
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Originally posted by FSRBIKER:
Now on the other hand the Hezbo's fill there Douchbag rockets full of ball bearings to inflict as much collateral damage as possible as well as fight from inside civilian occopied areas...BOTH big no-no's as agreed upon by the civilized world.
I also heard Newt Gingrich speaking about the 2000+ UN troops that have been in the south of Lebanon since the Israel occupation ended and these troops did nothing to stop the Hezbo's or enforce the UN mandate to disarm the Hezbo's. You are absolutely correct. UN forces (UNIFIL)have been in Southern Lebanon for many years. They have been in Lebanon since UNIFIL was created in 1978. UN forces have observed the buildup of Hezbollah in Lebananon. They were fully aware of the construction of the bunkers Hezbollah has built all around S. Lebanon. The UN forces were fully aware of the arms buildup of Hezbollah. Did they share this information with Israel? No they did not. The UN was supposed to be there to prevent Hezbollah's presence in S. Lebanon. Some UN facts.... Over the past six years, Israel honored its commitment to peace. The U.N. — disproportionately — required in practice no such compliance on the Lebanese side of the border. The “peacekeepers” of the U.N. Interim Force in Lebanon, called UNIFIL, sat passively looking on, costing about $100 million a year and doing nothing to stop Hezbollah from trucking in weapons, digging tunnels, and running the armed protection rackets with which it has kept a grip on swathes of Lebanon, including the southern border with Israel, parts of the Bekaa, and southern Beirut. Before the current fighting, UNIFIL had most recently distinguished itself for a run-of-the-U.N.-mill financial swindle involving a contingent of Ukrainian peacekeeping troops. On that subject, whatever laws might have been violated, the U.N. has — as usual with U.N. scams — refused to release details. Now, UNIFIL peacekeepers have been reduced to casualties of the crossfire, while Secretary-General Kofi Annan urges that we take what the U.N. has done wrong already, and do more of it.
With its false promises, and disproportionate deals for “peace,” the U.N. left Israel exposed to the attack that has now come, and a war that Israel did not seek. Like America when attacked by al Qaeda, Israel has been fighting back. In response, U.N. officials have come close to trampling each other in their stampede to the media microphones — not to admit the U.N.’s own failure to stop Hezbollah, not to apologize for administering a phony peace that incubated this miserable war, but to denounce Israel. Here is a picture of a UN outpost in S. Lebanon. Supposedly the one that was hit with a bomb. The Hezbollah flag flies right next to the UN flag (notice the Hezbollah flag flies in a superior position to that of the UN flag). Early reports stated a Hezbollah mortar fired on the UN position. The story was quickly changed.  A picture is worth a thousand words. The UN aids and abets the Hezbollah terrorist organization. Why does the corrupt Kofi Anann meet with the terrorist Nasrallah? Hezbollah is not a country. It's not a state. It's a terrorist organization with one goal... the destruction of a member state of the UN.  Again, a picture is worth a thousand words. The corrupt leader of the UN shaking hands and hobknobbing with one of the world's most notorious terrorists. Kofi Anan cries when an Israeli bomb lands on a UN outpost. His hatred of Israel and support for terrorists keeps him from telling the entire story, regardless of the fact that UNIFIL press releases say otherwise. http://www.un.org/Depts/dpko/missions/unifil/pr04.pdf http://www.un.org/Depts/dpko/missions/unifil/pr08.pdf http://www.un.org/Depts/dpko/missions/unifil/pr09.pdf http://www.un.org/Depts/dpko/missions/unifil/pr010.pdf Anann ignores that Hezbollah is firing from positions right next to UN outposts. He also fails to complain about Hezbollah mortars landing on UN positions... Another UN position of the Ghanaian battalion in the area of Marwahin in the western sector was also directly hit by one mortar round from the Hezbollah side last night. The round did not explode, and there were no casualties or material damage. Another 5 incidents of firing close to UN positions from the Israeli side were reported yesterday. It was also reported that Hezbollah fired from the vicinity of four UN positions at Alma ash Shab, Tibnin, Brashit, and At Tiri. All UNIFIL positions remain occupied and maintained by the troops. The mainstream press is also ignoring these facts. The NY Sun reports on a Canadian soldiers observation of the warzone.... http://www.nysun.com/article/36860 A Canadian U.N. observer, one of four killed at a UNIFIL position near the southern Lebanese town of Khiyam on Tuesday, sent an e-mail to his former commander, a Canadian retired major-general, Lewis MacKenzie, in which he wrote that Hezbollah fighters were "all over" the U.N. position, Mr. MacKenzie said. Hezbollah troops, not the United Nations, were Israel's target, the deceased observer wrote. The UN has already been caught letting Palestinian terrorists use their ambulances to transport men and arms. The UN needs to get out of the warzone. They are a problem. They already allowed a terrorist army to buildup men and arms and fly their flag next to theirs. With the removal of the UN from S. Lebanon we can then eliminate the UN as collaborators with Hezbollah.
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#210590 - 27/07/06 11:27 AM
Re: Lebanon and Israel
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Member
Registered: 20/12/01
Posts: 4932
Loc: Fort Worth, TX
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Great post man. That sums up the UN situation well. I have only heard a couple of tidbits about it. Thanks.
_________________________
Redsox1113: F*** Iran, the only thing that ever came out of iran was the iron sheik, and hulk hogan whipped his ass. F'em
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#210591 - 27/07/06 11:35 AM
Re: Lebanon and Israel
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Member
Registered: 09/05/02
Posts: 5232
Loc: Florida
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Originally posted by 2001frontier:
Great post man. That sums up the UN situation well. I have only heard a couple of tidbits about it. Thanks. Don't forget because of the bombing of the UN compound, this is the first open reports we are hearing about the Chinese being present in the war zone. The Chinese are there to spy and evaluate the weaponry being used. http://www.debka.com/headline.php?hid=2986
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#210592 - 27/07/06 12:16 PM
Re: Lebanon and Israel
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Member
Registered: 05/07/02
Posts: 4373
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Could it be that Americans are sheep who's thoughts and opinions are molded by their Government who really is run by Halliburton and all the other arms manufactures?. The quest to become the modern times new Roman Empire is neatly wrapped in words like "Freedom", "Democracy" and Axis of Evil when in fact your 900 billion defence budget is just padding the pocket of your so call "Social Elite" while your countrymen are sacrificing their lives for a cause we all know is now the new Vietman that will end in a rightious pull out of Iraq with everyone declaring victory...
Just a thought....discuss
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Sharam can have my sister
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#210593 - 27/07/06 12:31 PM
Re: Lebanon and Israel
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Member
Registered: 09/05/02
Posts: 5232
Loc: Florida
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Originally posted by Claus:
Could it be that Americans are sheep who's thoughts and opinions are molded by their Government who really is run by Halliburton and all the other arms manufactures?. The quest to become the modern times new Roman Empire is neatly wrapped in words like "Freedom", "Democracy" and Axis of Evil when in fact your 900 billion defence budget is just padding the pocket of your so call "Social Elite" while your countrymen are sacrificing their lives for a cause we all know is now the new Vietman that will end in a rightious pull out of Iraq with everyone declaring victory...
Just a thought....discuss Obviously 'thought' was something that did not occur within you prior to your posting of that tripe. There was a time when you occasionally posted rational and intelligent posts. I guess times have changed.
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#210594 - 27/07/06 12:36 PM
Re: Lebanon and Israel
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Member
Registered: 17/04/01
Posts: 8849
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Originally posted by NY Madman: Originally posted by Claus:
[b]Could it be that Americans are sheep who's thoughts and opinions are molded by their Government who really is run by Halliburton and all the other arms manufactures?. The quest to become the modern times new Roman Empire is neatly wrapped in words like "Freedom", "Democracy" and Axis of Evil when in fact your 900 billion defence budget is just padding the pocket of your so call "Social Elite" while your countrymen are sacrificing their lives for a cause we all know is now the new Vietman that will end in a rightious pull out of Iraq with everyone declaring victory...
Just a thought....discuss
There was a time when you occasionally posted rational and intelligent posts. I guess times have changed.[/b]. . . or he could be bored and posting an obviously inflammatory line of crap designed to push a button and elicit a response . . .
_________________________
Does anybody remember laughter?
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#210595 - 27/07/06 12:37 PM
Re: Lebanon and Israel
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Originally posted by Claus:
Just a thought....discuss No thanks. You're right. We're all sheep. None of us follow current events or politics. We just wait for our next brainwashing installment. You nailed it. ![[Freak]](graemlins/freak.gif)
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#210596 - 27/07/06 12:39 PM
Re: Lebanon and Israel
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Member
Registered: 05/07/02
Posts: 4373
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Originally posted by NY Madman: Originally posted by Claus:
[b]Could it be that Americans are sheep who's thoughts and opinions are molded by their Government who really is run by Halliburton and all the other arms manufactures?. The quest to become the modern times new Roman Empire is neatly wrapped in words like "Freedom", "Democracy" and Axis of Evil when in fact your 900 billion defence budget is just padding the pocket of your so call "Social Elite" while your countrymen are sacrificing their lives for a cause we all know is now the new Vietman that will end in a rightious pull out of Iraq with everyone declaring victory...
Just a thought....discuss
There was a time when you occasionally posted rational and intelligent posts. I guess times have changed.[/b]A few things happened: I watched "why we fight" I watched my buddy on the front page of the National post carry his soldiers coffin in Afghanistan I watch Children writing messages on Bombs who kill other children I see the great quest for the liberation of Iraq going nowhere I see people dying of starvation in 3rd world countries for centuries, yet no one gives a flying fuck. The world is becoming one big pyle of shit. positive progress is nowhere..... Take a side, Lebanon (Hezbollah) or Israel I can guarantee you none of them are squeaky clean, the losers in all this, Civilians innocent people who are trapped, makes me fucking sick.
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Sharam can have my sister
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#210597 - 27/07/06 12:40 PM
Re: Lebanon and Israel
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Originally posted by GrayHam:
or he could be bored and posting an obviously inflammatory line of crap designed to push a button and elicit a response . . . The thought crossed my mind, but I'm not familiar enough with his views.... I actually generally find him intelligent.
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#210598 - 27/07/06 12:42 PM
Re: Lebanon and Israel
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Member
Registered: 17/04/01
Posts: 8849
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Originally posted by FlyFishingX: Originally posted by GrayHam:
[b]or he could be bored and posting an obviously inflammatory line of crap designed to push a button and elicit a response . . . Give him a couple more posts. Maybe he was sincere, based on his last post to Madman. But he's never shied away from flamewars, and inciting them. So I wonder . . .
_________________________
Does anybody remember laughter?
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#210599 - 27/07/06 12:44 PM
Re: Lebanon and Israel
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Member
Registered: 09/05/02
Posts: 5232
Loc: Florida
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Originally posted by GrayHam:
. . . or he could be bored and posting an obviously inflammatory line of crap designed to push a button and elicit a response . . . That thought did cross my mind. But I'm also aware of his politics and his tendency towards moonbattery. As was previously mentioned in this thread... he's one of the "Canadians".
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#210600 - 27/07/06 12:49 PM
Re: Lebanon and Israel
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Member
Registered: 05/07/02
Posts: 4373
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Originally posted by GrayHam: Originally posted by FlyFishingX: [b] Originally posted by GrayHam:
[b]or he could be bored and posting an obviously inflammatory line of crap designed to push a button and elicit a response . . . The thought crossed my mind, but I'm not familiar enough with his views.... I actually generally find him intelligent.[/b]
Maybe he was sincere, based on his last post to Madman.
But he's never shied away from flamewars, and inciting them. So I wonder . . .[/b]Serious as a heart attack. I am not taking sides with anyone in this just saying the fucking senseless waste of human life and cash has got to stop. I am dumbfounded that American's still applaude what is going on, while their government is digging a hole for their future that will impact life for each of you for years to come. do not get me wrong. I would love for Iraq, afghanistan,Israel Lebanon and all the other armpit countries to be green pastures with humming birds and big titted flower girls but it ain;t going to happen, not by force not by anymeans. So why are we (I say we as my fellow countrymen are in it too) wasting resources ?.
_________________________
Sharam can have my sister
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#210601 - 27/07/06 12:53 PM
Re: Lebanon and Israel
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Member
Registered: 05/07/02
Posts: 4373
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Originally posted by NY Madman: Originally posted by GrayHam:
[b]. . . or he could be bored and posting an obviously inflammatory line of crap designed to push a button and elicit a response . . .
But I'm also aware of his politics and his tendency towards moonbattery.
As was previously mentioned in this thread... he's one of the "Canadians".[/b]Hey Madman, Give me your prediction to the outcome of: The current shit in Israel The current shit in Iraq The Current shit in Afghanistan I will save your reply and open it again in 8 years, then look you up and buy you a hooker and a steak dinner if ANY of your predictions came through....
_________________________
Sharam can have my sister
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#210602 - 27/07/06 12:57 PM
Re: Lebanon and Israel
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Originally posted by Claus:
I see people dying of starvation in 3rd world countries for centuries, yet no one gives a flying fuck. This is a whole issue unto itself. Read these: Article 1 Article 2
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#210603 - 27/07/06 12:59 PM
Re: Lebanon and Israel
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Member
Registered: 09/05/02
Posts: 5232
Loc: Florida
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Originally posted by Claus:
Serious as a heart attack. I am not taking sides with anyone in this just saying the fucking senseless waste of human life and cash has got to stop. That right there is part of your problem. By not taking sides, you are either displaying ignorance of the facts of the conflict or you are supporting and legitimizing the terrorist organization Hezbollah. Maybe it's a Canadian thing.
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#210604 - 27/07/06 01:04 PM
Re: Lebanon and Israel
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Originally posted by Claus:
I am not taking sides with anyone in this just saying the fucking senseless waste of human life and cash has got to stop. I am dumbfounded that American's still applaude what is going on, while their government is digging a hole for their future that will impact life for each of you for years to come.
do not get me wrong. I would love for Iraq, afghanistan,Israel Lebanon and all the other armpit countries to be green pastures with humming birds and big titted flower girls but it ain;t going to happen, not by force not by anymeans. So why are we (I say we as my fellow countrymen are in it too) wasting resources ?. You know Claus, in a perfect world I wish that we (or any other Western colonial power) never stepped foot in the Mid East. Westerners have a long history of sticking their dicks where they don't belong. The current situation with international terrorism and radical Islam require some sort of action, however. I'm a personal pacifist, but I'm pragmatic enough to understand that this shit isn't just going to go away if you close your eyes and hum a happy tune to yourself.
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#210605 - 27/07/06 01:06 PM
Re: Lebanon and Israel
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Member
Registered: 20/12/01
Posts: 4932
Loc: Fort Worth, TX
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We are 'wasting' resources, because they want to kill us all. They have made it very plain. If you are not an Islamofacist they want you to die. It is just like the Crusades all over again. They started it, and the West finished it. Unfortunately we are to pussy to do what it takes to punish them enough so they give up for another 1,000 years.
Go read Zawahiri's comments on this new tape, and come back to us with the same attitude.
_________________________
Redsox1113: F*** Iran, the only thing that ever came out of iran was the iron sheik, and hulk hogan whipped his ass. F'em
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