Man, that just sucks. I know I'd hate to be out there for 2 days. And I just keep thinking to my self the sense of dread and panic that would kick in when your in the middle of that huge flat barren dry-lake and you realize your tires are spinning but you aren't moving. you really do have my sympathy for being stuck out there for two days. I can understand how that would count as a traumatic event, I can see how that would cause some one to latch on to the closest thing to blame to hide their own shame when they realize the bad situation they are in is due to no fault but their own. Then only to have them selves mocked and laughed at by numerous individuals over the internet, I can understand how that would make someone unerved, pissed and obsessed.

Maybe you just need a hug. After all if you are in a mentally unstable state we can't really hold you accountable to that, at least it's excusable in a court of law. So you have my sympathy for being stuck, but you did get stuck of your own accord, and for that you alone are held responsible.

Ok, maybe I'm a bit crazy!

[edit] I'm out for the weekend, see you guys in BB[/edit]

Keep avoidin' those pressing questions, Cary...

I pointed out that Xtoolbox was going to NOT pre-run this same trip in 2004. I had lead and pre-ran it in 2001, 2002 & 2003. I offered to pre-run. No one stepped up. I made the mistake of asking him if he had gotten the required Mojave National Preserve Permit.

It got me banned for life.

The irony is with his bravado he said he would go first across Soda Lake with his "balding AT's with a stock 4x4". Anyone notice he chickened out and sent others to take the pictures in this XOC thread?

His "permitting stuff" is his George Orwellian double speak for he didn't bother to get the permit.

http://www.sccxterra.com/board/viewtopic.php?t=2151&postdays=0&postorder=asc&&start=4

These threads have never been about reality :rolleyes:

I hope your not holding your breath.

Jesus Christ, man. You're as bad at letting go as you are at vehicle recovery.

I was wondering the same thing, and I won't be able to make it to Big Bear this weekend to ask anyone in person. So, if anyone feels like filling in some of us newcommers . . .

Yes lets just see how good of a arm chair quarterback you are!

Mr. Arm Chair. A wide U-Turn? Right into the softer... none beaten path. That's pure genius!

Mr. Arm Chair. I had a pull-pay. Bought it in 2003 to anchor my Xterra encase Xtoolbox sank his Land Cruiser. I would have a anchor to winch him out.

http://www.sccxterra.com/board/viewtopic.php?t=1524&postdays=0&postorder=asc&&start=60

First put the winch in the back. Pulled out half the cable. Pulled the pull-pal all the way to me. Pulled out to the last wrap. Pulled the pull-pal all the way to me. Pulled out my 75 foot extension cable and hooked it onto the end of the winch line. Pulled the pull-pal all the way to me.

Did the same in front of me. It pulled the pull-pal but slower. Therefore I realized the only way out was forward.

Mr. Arm Chair. "Looking at your tires..." what PSI did I have in them? With the tires not formed around a rock and not even visible in the mud... how much? BFG 31x10.5x15 All Terrians. A whole lot better then Xtoolbox had in 2004. About what the group that left me had. Expect they were not locked.

My 48" and 60" were in the back of my Xterra along with one of my wide hi-lift platforms. The other was around 50 plus inches under the crust. Two guys in one anchor truck helped me. ALOT more stood around and took pictures behind my back.

Stuck on Thursday. Un-stuck on Saturday. I would call that 2 days. Some people in the group said I was stuck for 4 days. What is sad is the level people will go to avoid laws, By-Laws, rules, etc.

Wow, so you had all that equipment, people to help, and it still took ya two days.

Keep digging Cary...just remember to avoid those rocky pertinent questions.

Two trucks were locked in the rear.

The LIES JUST KEEP COMING.

Ummm ... he thought the poster was funny. So did I and others. Is it the picture that bothers you or is it the motivational message? If it is the picture, then, again, everything isn't about you. It's just a picture of a stuck truck.

If it is the message below the picture that has you so upset, then please let me know how you interpreted it to mock you. An apology may be in order by me.

You really think I created that poster with you in mind thinking, "I know how to stick it to Cary."? "Maybe I can turn his pathetic predicament into a mockery." Sure, I met you once but we never really spoke to each other, so no conflict there. You have never insulted me (until the recent feeble attempts), and you have never done anything to make me angry or upset. I hold no grudge against you for anything since I don't even really know you. Nope…you personally never entered my mind.

I know! It's the conspiracy theory. Xtoolbox used his almighty influence to coerce me to come up with a poster to mock you. We are all under his spell. Wooooo....

If anyone is turning this into a mockery, it is you and how you are handling the situation. I'm sorry to say that I am following along in the tone that you have set. Most people that had gone through what you did when you were stuck would have elicited responses showing sympathy or concern.

However, your messages elicit ridicule. But maybe that was your intent so that you could get much needed attention. If so, it's working. And you keep fueling the fire. So, I can only assume that is your intent here. Therefore, apparently the games are on! Page 30 - here we come!

Nope, not my quote.

Sorry, I'm playing catch-up in responding. I've been out all day.

So you are telling me, that a four foot pile of WHITE crusted mud:



Looks exactly like a 15 foot pile of BLACK rocks, in the middle of the day?



I would like to submit in to evidence exhibit A. A close-up picture of the Soda Lake soil conditions.



You can clearly see by the following image, that anybody in thier right mind would have seen the world of shit you were about to enter.. unless of course it was at night.. Also I only see one set of tracks there, not a well used path by any means.



Ummm, thats three days Cary. Here let me help you. Thursday - 1, Friday - 2, Saturday - 3. That is unless of course you were there late thursday night.... hmmm.

This isn't about me nor is it about my profession. I personally don't know you well enough to form an opinion about you one way or another. Don't make this personal. You chose to air your dirty laundry in public on an internet forum you are subject to all ridicule and "arm chair quarterbacking" people want to dish out.

Deal with it.

So what you are saying is that you were under the impression that you were prerunning for a run for a club that you were no longer a member of? Is that right?

Let's try this again:

So again... Let's focus:

Why were you prerunning? Were you under the impression that A) you were still a member of SCCX? and B) prerunning a run for them?

Are you respoonsible for the situation that you created with your relationship with SCCX?

Are you responsible for getting yourself stuck?

Do you feel that the anomosity you created with SCCXC and the members of SCCX led to them being less than interested in providing you anything but compulsory assistance?

Now concentrate.

When we were driving toward Soda Lake, a couple of ATV riders rode up to us and told us that there was an Xterra stuck out on the lake.

The information regarding the recovery details quoted above is what was relayed to us by them. It was not something we made up from 300 feet away or from imagination. There was no reason for us not to have believed the ATV riders at the time. Apparently they were mistaken in some respects.

If you had come right out from the beginning with an explanation of what really happened rather than trying to cover up your mistake, there would not have been the miscommunication in the chain of events. For the first time you are now explaining what happened from your viewpoint.



Uh, yeahhh. I wasn't about to drive out onto unsafe terrain and get myself stuck. I would have called some professionals in the area that had proper recovery gear and experience to help you out. But you had already done that and they were already there. Not much more I could have done.

Maybe offer you a ride, offer you some food and water, offer to help. But that had already been done and you had refused. Not much more I could have done.

I heard WolfmanX over the radio saying that you told him you didn't want our help. That is when we decided to leave. It was a slap in our face. It was as if you had said "sure, I'm stuck and can't get out, but there is no way I want YOUR help."

Cary - Are you ready to let this and all your other issues go yet? It doesn't seem right our having to respond to your accusations, which in turn only makes you look bad. But maybe you are really enjoying this?

Bullshit, Cary. What got you banned from the club was this kind of 15+ page (over and over again) Kennedy assassination conspiracy theory shit and your inability to let your beef with Xtoolbox just go. Both of you have fucked up, but Xtoolbox was willing to let bygones be bygones and so was the club. You created where you're at today, live with it.

Yeah.. the thread that started it ALL in June 2004, OVER TWO YEARS AGO:

http://www.sccxterra.com/board/viewtopic.php?t=1923

Keep in mind, there were many many more. This was the first I was aware of. LAX started showing his true colors here. Started the same way this thread started if you notice, saying he was selling his xterra, only to start an endless shit storm.

Then there was the thread in the SCCX XOC forum, that was apparently deleted I guess?

Round 3 - FIGHT!

well i read it... after all these years i had forgotten that thread... i was a lurker then, had not been active in the club for a while, but enjoyed reading what was happening and after the little refresher I must say Cary was right... or at least to him he was

you guys fucked up.... or at least didn't handle it well.

BUT, cary went off the deep end and couldn't just walk away... he had to convince you all that he was right... i made a similar mistake and have not been out with sccx since... closest thing was the last WestX which went... well, there is a reason it was the last one.

yeah Cary went screwy... i guess in his world he figured he had to attempt to pre-run the CCX memorial run because no one else would, maybe he just couldn't let go of his concern for others... and maybe in the back of his mind he hoped something would go wrong to prove to you all that he was right... problem is the only one that had a problem was him... it was a huge gamble to do that run without prerunning... it paid off for the SCCX group and not for Cary... In fact Cary's reputation on XOC went form knowledgable grouchy old timer, to complete lunatic stalker nut job over night.

Socalpunx and i discussed this when it first happened and those were the choices... concerned for others, half-hoping for disaster... or stalker nut job... and that still appears the only two logical choices to me.

If you look at the history I think Cary's point of view and emotional attachment is understandable... I'm sure he was hoping that if he threatened to leave, you guys might take notice, like with Lory, but that didn't happen... worse yet, in trying to get you guys to take notice he kept going on and on about something you all didnt agree with and/or did not see at the time(and maybe still don't)...

when you are a lone man standing on the street yelling at people about things they don't see... you're a nut job.

when you are yelling at a group of people who see things the way you do... you're preaching to the choir.

sadly Cary apparently still doesn't know the difference...

it's a tough pill to swallow, lets lay right and wrong aside for a minute...

Cary,
There is no way you will ever... ever... get them to see this your way... maybe one day they will experience something that makes them realize you were right... maybe not. But until then... you are just going to be labeled a lunatic and no one will actually look at what you have been saying for the last 2 years as anything more than the meandering ramblings and conspiracy theories of a deranged man.

SCCX,
Most of you were not around at the beginning... but it honestly was Cary, Brian, Lory and Steve(i thinkthat's right, been a long time... Y2K) they ran it.. as a team... it devolved a bit and became Cary Planning, Lory peace keeping and Brian taking all the credit and leading all the runs... this had to piss Cary off... i'm not putting words in his mouth, but the rest of us noticed it and it was definately a topic of discussion at the numerous photo stops and other annoying stoppages and we pondered how long Cary could handle it...

apparently only about 4 years.

I'm sure the SCCX of now is very different from then, but you have to understand that in all likelyhood NO ONE put more into building sccx than Cary... the time, the effort, the money, the heart, soul and emotion... imagine if you will that you spent the amount of time and effort he did, only to first have someone else take credit for all your work and then have people laugh at your opinion... mock you and generally disregard you...

Brian,
I know you are going to hate that last part... probably think i'm talking out of my ass, It's entirely possible that this is news to you... you may not have known how much your actions rubbed people the wrong way... There were several members back in the day that left because of that situation... i was not the only one. You are the face of SCCX, like it or not... your actions act as a large eraser for your words. It is very important to choose both... wisely.

look, opinions are like assholes.. everyone has one and they all stink, but that's what this comes down to... put yourself in the other guys shoes... in that regard I think it is pretty easy to understand peoples motivations for their actions... on both sides of the issue.

---edited to add message to brian and elaborate on a few things... also to fix some grammatical crap... although I'm sure more exists-----

There are two sides to that.

Cary may have had an opinion but he went about showing it the WRONG WAY.

It's like in grade school. The annoying whiney kids would always say "fine then, I'm leaving!" expecting some sort of reaction from the other kids, and then thriving on that reaction. Cary has stressed so many times that he is twice my age, twice my age, bla bla bla, and yet, he acts like a frustrated grade schooler.

Problem is, this isn't about SCCX. This whole god damn thing is about a fued between Cary and Xtoolbox.

Can't you all see that?

2004 people.

Two YEARS AGO.

LET IT GO!!!

this is the gospel truth...

sort of... it is ALL ABOUT SCCX and having too many chiefs and not enough indians.

To be honest I still have no idea why it went down the way it did... not that i really want an answer(as that appears to be what Cary is actualy after here), but it is fascinating to watch from a strictly psychological point of view... maybe it all boils down to charisma... because lets be honest Cary has none(sorry man, but there is a reason you are behind the camera), where as Brian makes a pretty good first impression.

Explain this to me more. Since you seem to be the expert, having never been on a run for.. how many years?

How many chiefs do we have? Well that depends, we have a Board member for each county that SCCX covers. How many members do we have? 40 active? who knows how many lurkers and web wheelers.

I guess I don't understand this statement.. are you speaking of past times previous to the new SCCX structure and by-laws?

The only folks bashing the current SCCX, are people who have not been on any runs or participated in any way shape or form. Yet, here are people who have been on one or two runs with us, posting here angry because they feel SCCX is being wrongfully attacked. If that doesn't show that things have changed, I don't know what will.

i got that far and stopped reading...

because you obviously didn't read my posts.

i have no idea what the issue is now... but i knwo there were serious issues way back in oh say... may of 2000...

the chiefs i was refering to were Brian and Cary.
-edited to add--

ok i finished reading your post...
I am not bashing SCCX now... I know next to nothing of SCCX now.. i think i have made that clear... also... I don't think this issue has much to do with SCCX now. but with the silent power struggle that was already in motion back in like may of 2000... if not earlier

Gotchya! Thanks for clearing that up.

wow this is some interesting shit.. seriously thou.. Can't we all just get along...

I have been readin it for years and I have to agree here. Over two years... this is a bit too much.

Everyone feels that way, except LAXterra. :rolleyes:
Come on Cary, we know you're not even close to being done.