I don't understand why it bothers you as long as they don't destroy the environment or other people's property. I could understand you bitching about the quart of oil on the ground. You do single Axle out when he does these things. You still haven't bitched me out for driving down Odessa with steprails still on. I almost flipped my truck on a muddy hill when I first got it. All I heard was that the hill wasn't as steep as I imagined it to be. I even floated it in a mudhole just to use the winch. I posted here about all of those things and was never called an idiot. All of those were stupid things to do in retrospect, but they all seemed like good ideas at the time. I think you are a little rough on Axle sometimes. It's not because I got in bed with him while I was naked at GOX is it?
You're both good guys, too bad you don't get along.

By the way, I nominated you for an episode of "Monster Garage" tonight. I think you'd be an interesting team member on the show. I think everyone here should e-mail a nomination in as well. Don't tell me you wouldn't like a big pile of free tools.

As far as Toderick is concerned, I think you blow the WestX thing out of proportion. I think it's because you felt betrayed when people you picked to lead didn't do what you felt they should have. I wasn't there that night, but if I had been, I would have gone out to help them myself when the trail bosses had to leave. I stayed to make sure Logan's truck was running and that he would get home the time he flooded it on the Mojave road. I wasn't running that trip, but you just don't leave people behind. I understood that other people had obligations and couldn't stay, so I stayed. There is no way I would hold that against those people, even if it had been me that was flooded. I don't think Logan holds a grudge against those that left and I don't think those peole at WestX are holding it against Axle. Let it go bud. Friends are too hard to find to dump them over crap like that. Love y'all.

I try to have a sense of humor, but I'm just tired of seeing this stuff. I have wheeled with a lot of people on this board, and I have my secret list of people who have no idea what they are doing. People I don't want to associate with, or drive with because they are a hazard or hindrance to people around them, especially at the large events or runs like those I host every year.

Sadly, it's a very long list, full of people who can't drive over any obstacle without a spotter, people who drive dangerously, people who have no common sense. People who are supposed to be improving their off-road driving skills, but aren't.

I talk to a lot of people off this board too, people who I respect, people who are skilled, people who confirm my thoughts about the people on my list because they have first hand knowledge as well.

This message board is for people to learn about their Xterras, and learn about safe 4 wheeling, but every couple of weeks I see something stupid and preventable like this and it just makes me wonder if it's worth the effort.

I lead all the trail runs for RMXC, and I lead trail runs at GOX and goneMOAB every year and there has never been an incident with any of them (with the exception of Weelit, but he was showing off) because I won't allow it.

I want all the club leaders and the people who are supposed to be showing the new people the ropes to step up and quit fucking around. A 4000 lb truck is not something to be playing with so casually or wrecklessly.

You were stroking yourself when you wrote that, weren't you?

I think you'd best step away from the keyboard and leave the room now before your head gets too big to fit through the door.
:p

I guess I must have made the list. I do things with my Xterra that a lot of people might feel are foolish(especially my wife). I let my nine and eleven year olds drive it on a dry lake bed. They are learning valuable lessons that may keep them from doing something stupid in the future. Just last week my nine year old learned why I tell him not to do a tight circle while moving quickly in a top heavy truck and my eleven year old learned why you shouldn't stomp on the brake unless it's an emrgency and I learned that when you are letting an eleven year old drive, you should wear your seatbelt no matter where you are and how short a time she will be driving. I've let them do this since my son was seven. I am always careful to make sure that no matter what happens, I won't hurt others or damage others' property or the environment. I can live with the damage I do to my truck, but I could never live with the damage I might do to others if I weren't safe about it. I've been with Axle on several trail runs and he always seems sane and safety concious. He has had bad luck and I don't doubt that he was driving in a sedate, sane manner when this latest mishap happened. I think he did the stand up thing when he put his truck in a ditch, rather than damage others. I think that given the same situation, many others would have just plowed their big steel bumper into the soft plastic ass of the people in front of them. That's probably what I would have done. I think Axle is a better offroad driver than I am. He walked up the easy side of the wall in one attempt during GOX. I had to try a few times to get the right line to clear my bumper. He's always the first one to help others when they're in a tight spot. I think it's OK to rag on him, but I don't know why he gets special attention. I never saw him cut down a tree(sorry Brent, but at least you know why Ian rags you). I can only guess that it's his non-apologetic, "I did what I thought was right" attitude. I prefer that to blaming his mishaps on the incompetence of others(not saying that you do that). I think the two of you just need to spend more time together.

Anybody second my "Monster Garage" nomination yet?

you know at first when i read Ian's posts i figured he was just being a prick like usual. Now that he has fully explained himself i think he's right. People need to step up and learn to drive before someone dies.

Of all the typos...

I am curious as to how the leader ran into a tree. Not judging or anything like that. Just curious. Was that also because of the ice?

We wanna see the list!!!

Oh wait never mind I am probably on it. I freely admit I am kind of a dumbass driver.

So axle what does it look like now. Are you gonna leave the scars on it?

can't we all just get along

No f'ing way! I had to go to word and do a spell check. It just doesn't look right like that! I'm usually pretty good at spotting stuff like that, but I never would have gotten that one.

No, you're on the other list.

You're on a different list.

Fine. Ignore what I have to say. Do what you want. Drive how you want. Learn nothing.

I do post on JU, but visit here periodicly to see whats going on... i post when i feel compelled...

which brings us to the second part...
I only posted because of the irony of you and now renee bitching about ian saying he would have left you behind... when it was actually YOU TWO that left others.

that and the irony that the two SCCX xterras that have rolled have been the two people whop have no regard for their vehicles, saftey, or the well being of those around them... it has been proven time and again.

you post does make me wonder.... So why did the leader hit a tree? that trail looks wide enough, was he going too fast also?

a lie concocted to save face when ian posted the pics... and you know it.

Cats out of the bag now. no more lies.

he was going 45 - 50 and hit a bump, caught air and landed too far to the right... he hit the brakes and stopped with two wheels barely on the trail.... after some time and a failed rescue his truck rolled.

That is definately part of it... Honestly i wa shurt that he would do something so stupid... tell peopel in stock xterra's that a 4 - 4.5 rated trail that normally takes 6-8 hours could be ran in 2... it was foolish irresponsible and dangerous.

Honestly i sort of understand why axle left... i think he was wrong, if his wife had to work, she should not have been with him... a leader doesn't leave.

BUT, Xtoolbox is the one i was really pissed at... cause not only did he leave people, he heard them say they were stuck and for him to wait over his FRS... and just drove on, later claiming he didn't hear it...

Wow. Logan had me fooled for a long time.

Am I on your list Ian? I know there is at least one ex PNWX member on it. THere have been a few on the official PNWX list for sure.

your original caption of "2wd + speed <> 4x4" freaked him out, and a elaborate story was concocted to try and make it not look so reckless and to also take the "2wd" out of the equation... which was i think unfair of you... 2wd had nothing to do with what happened... driving faster than conmditions allowed did

RENEE,

BTW, I am sorry to hear about your truck... I have been there when it was slightly damaged in the past and I know you really do care what happens to it... Its a shame to see ANY Xterra go through that.

Whatever you want to think of me, fine. I'm done arguing with you over it.

Todrick, you weren't doing shit out there anyways so somebody had to. I didn't force anybody to follow me up that trail. And if your such a great offroader why don't you get your pansy little ass in your jeep and come out here and show me how it's done, or are you afraid to scratch it?

Holy Crap!

this thread has really gotten nasty. Alot of dirty laundry is being aired out.

I hope nothing is being said that will be regreted later.

This thread is all about elite off-roading skills...

I don't know about you guys but I off road to enjoy myself. Not to harass or criticize on a message board. Axle made a decision... he lived with it. Why people can't leave him alone, I don't know... it's not like he rammed into someone's truck or another person. He made the choice that only affected him.

As far as I am concerned... this thread seems to be all about who has the BIGGER E-PENIS when it comes to off-roading.

People need to learn how to chill.

Well.... back to the original Oops it fell over part of the topic...

Got an estimate on the damage yet? How did it run after being put shiny side up?

Hey "Shit Happens", mine did just before getting online, and I feel much better now.