Yup. Most Presidents are former governors, NOT former Congress-men. There's a reason for that... Too many bills through Congress, with assinine clauses, that makes a person vote yes for one thing, then no, the next time around. Makes them look like they don't know how to take a stand/position on anything. The comprimising gets them in trouble, when it comes to being the leader of the country.

So that's one more thing Hillary will have to worry about, if she were to run. She'll have to have some sort of experience being the leader of something (like maybe a VP, first), before she will be a candidate that could win the Presidency. I would expect her to run as a VP in 2008, not the Pres.

The current Republican party is imploding, what with the fundies pissed off at the moderates, the moderates pissed off at the fundies, and the corporate hacks pissed at both sides.

All the Dems have to do is sit back, drink some iced tea, and enjoy the show.

The only thing that would unite the Republicans at this point would be if Hillary got nominated. They ALL hate her.

Which is why I really hope they DON'T nominate her. It would be suicide.

Really? Gee, I guess I should look around some more... I have yet to see a Republican say they weren't going to vote Republican anymore, based on this "implosion"... Hell, there's not a chance that the so-called "fundi's" or the so-called "moderates" are going to swing their votes over to the dumb, err, dark side...

It's not Hillary that unites us... It's Democrats in general...

you'll have to excuse WilMac...he's been sipping the "iced tea"

There's already been some rumbling - fundies v. corporates.

Each believes they deserve what they want - and they don't coincide.

Frist is already in the doghouse with Republicans for letting some moderates go over his head and negotiate a deal with Democrats.

Not only that, the man is a DOCTOR that believes you can get AIDS from saliva. Yeah, that's the kind of genius Americans want running the country.

Santorum has said a TON of asanine things.

Not to mention all the hot water DeLay has found himself in.

You all have a MAJORITY in the House, Senate, you have the Presidency, and a majority on the Supreme Court, and you STILL haven't been able to get shit accomplished. And the reason is because of the corporate vs. fundie fight that is going on in the Republican ranks.

The Republicans are suffering from being too successful in the last election. They snuggled up to the far right despite their better judgement, and now the far right expect payback (on abortion and gay rights issues, for example) .. and rightly so. Easier said than done, with most moderate Republicans dragging their feet on such issues and wishing their far right constituents would simply go away. They won't.

Now we have the usual political scandals, with the latest being with DeLay. The Dems won't let this go away. If DeLay is proven to be a sleazeball the Republicans will outcast him in a second, but the damage will already have been done.

And let's not forget Iraq and related noise (abuse issues at Gitmo). Stuff like this stick.

So no, I don't think the Republican party is imploding ... not by a long shot. But the euphoria of the 2004 elections is over. All is not well with them but with the likes of Karl Rove around I expect they'll do wonders in the next election.

_Lazza

PS - however if gas prices do not drop I'd say the Republicans are in really deep doo-doo.

This is why I really wish the Republican's worst nightmare would return to the political stage...James Carville. Love him or hate him, he's just as effective as Rove.

Barak Obama...

That is, if America can get past having a black president with a funny name. Lord knows, they probably can't.

I could see him winning at some point, but I think '08 is a bit early - he's still pretty new to the national scene.

Are you serious? The true moderates of both parties can swing either way in an election. I'm sure a lot of moderate Republicans would certainly not vote for somebody like Santorum or DeLay.

I used to be a registered Republican (now I'm an independent), and there is absolutely positively NO WAY IN HELL that I would ever even slightly consider voting for somebody like DeLay or Santorum. I don't give a shit who's on the other side - I don't think the best thing for America right now is a bigoted corrupt Nazi.

That's not to say I'd like to cast my vote for somebody like Hillary or Kerry - but if it's one of them versus a right-wing neo-con, I will. Ideally I'll get to vote for a more moderate candidate (from either party).

If the Republicans keep moving to the right they'll find themselves on the other side of the power balance very quickly.

First, learn how to fucking spell. Second, show me any statement I've ever made that could remotely be considered "liberal" (at least in the textbook sense). I know you're not that smart, but it's just one word, and you should learn its meaning, especially if you're gonna go applying it to people. Third, since when is it a bad thing to "talk shit about this country and its leadership"? This country's leadership stinks to high hell, and its denizens are the dumb fucks who allow them to bend us over the counter. More people should be talking shit about this country and its leadership--we're getting fucked, not fondled, and it's about damn time you "conservatives" (conservative is in quotation marks because you're not conservative, you're Police State Liberals, as opposed to Welfare State Liberals) woke the fuck up and realized your blind adherence to this wannabe John Wayne propaganda is spurious, worth fuck-all, and call it what you want, it ain't "conservative" and it sure as hell ain't "defending freedom". It's corporate greed in a cowboy hat, and if you aren't smart or aware enough to see that, then you deserve the shitstorm you reap.

Near as I can tell, the only thing I mispelled is your Arabian dope smoking device.

If fuckwads like you would spend a little more time trying to make your country a better place rather than just pissing and moaning about how fucked up you think it is, maybe....JUST MAYBE things would improve.

Do you vote?
Do you get involved in your community and get active in matters important to you?

Or do you just expect someone else to do it for you?

I vote in every election. I'm active with federal and local land use agencies around multi use issues. I spent 5 years in the military, including the first gulf war. I voluneteer for the USFS and worked for them all through high school and college. I provide a great website similar to XOC to thousands of people free of charge. I'm an NRA member - because I believe in my second amendment rights.

What do you give back to your country? Don't tell me about all the taxes you pay because I'm sure I've paid more than you have.

What makes me a "police state liberal"? Is it because I get annoyed hearing people like you bitch about the country I love? Is it because I look around the world and see that this is still the best country on the planet in which to live and prosper? Is it because I work hard to make a good living for me and my family and don't think that handouts to those who won't work for themselves should be given? Or is it because I support our military along with the decision to oust a tyrant guilty of 25 years of genocide against his own people? Well....Which is it?

You're right. Perhaps I am misusing the word, "liberal". It's very easy around here to apply that term to every cry baby who complains about the way things are without lifting a finger to do anything about it. On second thought, maybe I'm not so far off after all.

You're all talk.

I made my points. Your comebacks are thin at best.

Agreed.

I'm a Republican by registration, but consider myself a swing voter. I vote for the person, not the party. Kerry's redux of his Vietnam press conferences (this time against Gulf II), didn't qualify as an effective campaigning method, so there was no way for him to earn my vote.

My hope is that both parties will come up with candidates who want what's best for America and have the facilities to employ solutions. I want to be torn between two strong candidates instead of feeling like I'm voting for the "lesser evil".

I don't think Shahram told us one good thing he does for the country in his comeback, unless you count bitching and moaning. A good attempt at some witty comebacks but not much substance. All I got out of it was that he votes for worthless candidates and likes to bitch. Keep up the good work.

Don't worry. This is typical for his posts. In his never-ending attempt at wittiness, he never, ever, posts anything of substance. Or any actual useful information in a comeback. In all honesty, he really sucks at the whole internete arguement... You can't always win by being funny...most times you just end up looking stupid.

Listen, kids, I'm only gonna say this once.

It's the internet. More importantly, it's XOC.

I never post anything of substance. It's true. But for your own sake, please don't come to XOC for substance. You want substance? Read a fucking book. Pick up the latest issue of the Economist. Take a college course, or visit a museum. You ain't gonna get it from XOC.
Plus, it's not exactly wise to get into some sort of substantial argument with some mouth-breather who doesn't understand the basic fundamentals of politics, culture, history, or anything else about how the world is formed around him. How can you have a proper discussion with someone whose only response is "Well, if you don't like it, why don't you move to Iran where you came from." We're not exactly talking about an exchange between geniuses here.
I've tried arguing with fact, but it's slow, and these threads happen quick. Plus, facts are usually ignored:

Shahram: According to the Tax Foundation, California subsidizes the nation at unrivaled levels....here are some numbers...

Desert_Rat: I don't care about numbers. Californians is faggots. Faggots should go back to Mexico.

off2cjb: Jesus hates faggots. And Mexicans. When MY Lord comes, they will all pay for their transgressions against America.

porsche996: And if you don't like it, you should pack up your Volvo and leave the country.

2001Frontier: And while you're at it, take your Mexican boyfriend with you!

See? That was taken from an actual thread! The only thing I left out was the 82 misspellings and 347 grammar mistakes.

My point is, any amount of substance would probaby be wasted on you lot, so why bother? The best I can hope for is that I get a laugh out of somebody. One thing you can't argue is that my posts are consistently funny. And if they're not funny, they're at least entertaining.

Maybe I do suck at the whole "internete debate" thingy...so you're like, what, XOC's James Carville now? You've got the market cornered on wit and wisdom? C'mon, dude, I've seen enough of your posts to conclude that you aren't exactly the Modern Enlightened Man you'd like to think you are.

You CAN always win by being funny. Being funny brings you out of the game, it transcends the argument. It breaks the tension. It flusters, frustrates, and generally fucks with people who get so caught up in their own bullshit, that they can't see straight. It's fun. And as for me looking stupid, well, I'm definitely not afraid to look stupid. Hell, I'd rather look stupid than be stupid.

I guess this is why it's called the "Xterra Owner's Club". Lurker!

Seems to me that some folks have been banned for inciting arguments without having anything productive to say.

I guess we've been through all of this before haven't we?

Enjoy your thoughts as you're the only one who cares about them. Have a pleasant stay will ya?

Woohoo! Since we're playing the, "stupid quotes from stupid folks" game, here's a few classics:

(Note, they are ALL from Sharam...)

"Nope, the next truck I buy will have been built by some ancestor-worshipping kamikaze midget, not some PBR-drunk Bubba with a third-grade education and a $40 a day meth habit to support."

"I dated a junkie, okay"

"Don't forget that Dec. 7th marks the beginning of "Chakakhan", the Jewish celebration of Christmas. The Jew lights seven candles, one for each Jew banker that lives underneath the earth in a secret bunker and controls the world's money supply."

And finally:

"Hey, didn't I win this thread last week?"

You did get one thing right, though. You definately only post things that you think are funny. Come to think of it, when taken out of context, you are pretty funny. Or sad. I can't figure out which.

Saddest thing is, as much as you profess to hate XOC, the members here, the conversations, etc., you still keep coming here. I realize this must be your relief...posting illegible psuedo-intelligent dribble trying to man-up to whomever you're responding, by attempting to sound intellectually humorous. See, I can throw together a bunch of words in some random order, and sound stupid doing it, too. The thing is, this is how all your posts come off. I only hope, for your sake, you are only sounding stupid, instead of being stupid.

So go ahead. Pick through this post, and do the only thing you're good at...spell check. Congratulations. I've found that the only purpose you serve is to spell check others. Congratulations! You've now relegated yourself as a cheap Microsoft tool.

Keep the spell check coming. XOC definately needs a spell checking secretary. God knows we all forgot how to spell, once computers came around. Turns out it's not worth the effort when any monkey w/ a keyboard can do it for you.

Damn You fixed your typo before I could quote it... Nice job, now what the hell can he do?

I can't possibly be the only person that thinks Shahram brings the funny can I?

As far as his not having an Xterra, there are a lot of people who post here that don't drive an X (anymore or never had one) that are less entertaining than Angry Sharamy.

No one is going to change the world with any political discussions on XOC anyways. Nor is anyone going to change their mind with anything anyone says here.

And Desert_Rat, excepting your military service, your social contributions seem only related to issues that directly affect you and there is probably someone working harder than you are to counter your efforts. It's the American way.

So really, by doing nothing but standing on the sidelines and bitching, Shahram is probably breaking even.

I'd buy Desert_Rat a beer before I would Shahram, unless I'm coming out of the Men's room with it.

It's all in fun! Good ol' internet, gatta love it!