After seeing this:

I must conclude:

Yes...very much so.

Where exactly have you read anything stating as *fact* that it even originated in the gay community? Come to think of it...I don't think it's been the gay community spreading it in Africa.

Are blacks largely responsible for Trichomoniasis? Are whites largely responsible for scabies? Here's an interesting one: Heterosexuals are TWICE as likely to have nongonococcal urethritis as homosexual men. Damn...we straight guys spread disease and shit worse than others!

Using your logic, it must be so:

NIH study on STD\'s

Here's another from NIH:
(note that in June, 1982, only one year after the first rumblings of AIDS, it was found in homosexuals, hemophiliacs, IV drug users and Haitians. NOT just gays. Damn...maybe it was those fucking Haitians! And January 1983, it showed up in heterosexual couples as well. Screening of blood didn't occur until several years later - gee...were gays responsible for that, too?)

AIDS Timeline

I thought the spreading of AIDS was due to men of all walks of life having sex with apes.

Nobody knows. I seriously doubt we'll ever know. One of the NIH pages suggested it may have passed from apes to humans several times, possibly as early as 100 years ago. But they don't have a clue *how* it passed. It could have been using the animal for food, using the animal to develop vaccines (a polio vaccine was suspect for a time), or yes, even some twit screwing one.

AIDS was spread throughout North America and Europe by homosexual men. It still is the prime source of infection.

They even traced it back to one French Canadian flight attendant. It was introduced to the North American populace by promiscuous homosexuals in bath houses.

Bisexuals and intravenous drug addicts are responsible for the crossover to the straight population. Some got it from the blood supply but that was taken care of in the 80's.

AIDS is and will always be primarily a homosexual disease in the West. A very small percentage of people have gotten it from heterosexual contact regardless of the propaganda that has been put forth by homosexual advocates. Everytime a heterosexual has gotten AIDS there is a drug addict, gay or bisexual contact somewhere in a partners sexual history.

As far as Africa goes.... AIDS is prevelant in the heterosexual population because of the culture over there. In most African cultures females live in a "sex on demand" type culture that Western woman do not endure. It is a females "duty" to satisfy men sexually over there. They have little say in it in most African cultures.

28% in 2001 is hardly a "very small percentage." ( source ) Regardless of people's past history, it is still 28% from heterosexual contact. And to say "everytime" is a bit presumptuous. It is EXTREMELY rare for a guy to get it from a female. Hell, they don't even keep track of female-to-female transmission, according to the CDC's tables.

Heterosexuals are promiscuous, too. Just ask Clinton.

The fact is, it's already out there. People need to stop bitching about "where" it came from, and keep working on how to stop it.

The fact is my post is still 100% legit, and I was called ignorant for no reason. You homosexual-sympathetic people out there can continue to call me ignorant, but the truth remains that calling me ignorant was not the appropriate insult. At least insult me properly.

By the way, if you do insult me properly you will find yourself in a one sided flame war. I have no internet ego, and whatever things you think you can say that are 'mean' or would 'own' me will just end up making you look childish. I'm 22, so if you act more childish than I, then you have a lot of growing up to do.

Todrick, I love the shirt. Will you send me one? I would honestly wear it.

sure, that will be $29.95 you can paypal it to me.

I'm not sure of the validity of the site in your link. The truth is it is hard to get accurate data regarding AIDS and it's sources out of fear of offending the homosexual lobby. They don't even classify contact as homosexual anymore. Most of the time it is described as "MSM" contact.

Even if that 28% figure were true, what is the breakdown of females to males within that 28%. Females get it from having sex with bisexual males. A more pertinant figure would be... how many heterosexual males are getting AIDS from heterosexual contact. Are they afraid to reveal these figures? I don't see any. The infection rate for intravenous drug users has sharply declined over the years so we are basically left with homosexuals and bisexuals as the main culprits in the spread of AIDS in North America and Europe.

Another thing I find very peculiar is they always break down the infection rates by race. Blacks have a higher per capita infection rate. Why is that? They have the same anatomy as whites. Could it be a cultural problem? Is this whitey's fault? There are some who try to spin it that way. Inquiring minds want to know.

Yeah sure... heterosexuals are promiscuous. No where near the rate of promiscuity amongst male homosexuals. Have you ever seen a heterosexual bath house? I'm sure lesbians don't even have places like that and if they do are probably extremely rare. Even female deviants have limits to their perversion.

I disagree with your statement regarding people need to stop bitching about where the disease is coming from. People need MORE information about where it comes from and they need to be told the TRUTH. Especially women. If they can avoid bisexual men then their rate of infection would drastically be reduced and there would be fewer children born with this disease. Too bad about the gay advocates being offended. They can go to hell.

This is another example of political correctness playing games with innocent lives.

Another thing regarding AIDS that has to stop is the plethora of these "so-called" AIDS charities that are actually front groups for homosexual lobbying organizations. They collect money and dupe the public and donors into thinking the funds are going towards research when a large part of the money goes to lobby politicians in Washington and the state capitols in passing an ever increasing amount of gay legislation.

Again, it hasn't *sharply* declined for any group. For drug users, it has remained fairly constant. The figures are on the CDC website: CDC AIDS Cases by exposure category

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Yeah sure... heterosexuals are promiscuous. No where near the rate of promiscuity amongst male homosexuals. Have you ever seen a heterosexual bath house?

Yes I have. The legal ones are in Nevada (but at least there, they get checked regularly). I'm curious where there is data showing the comparison of promiscousness between ANY group.

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If they can avoid bisexual men then their rate of infection would drastically be reduced and there would be fewer children born with this disease.

There aren't THAT many bisexual men out there to "drastically" redue the infection rate. But...that did make me notice one thing - I don't see anywhere on the CDC website showing how many babies are born with it. The closest thing is an article saying the CDC estimated it to be 280-370 in 2000 (consider in 1991 is was about 1760 in 1991). Source

Mobycat, so you are pretty familiar with a lot of bisexual men?

Actually, no. I can't think of any I know off the top of my head. I did know a number of bisexual women. I know quite a number of gay men, and not one of them is promiscuous. I know more promiscuous straight people than promiscuous gay people.

In response to Dipstick's comment from a few posts back that

This is, quite possibly, the most ignorant comment I've ever read on the board. You obviously have never studied this crises, nor educated yourself before you make a comment about it.

The reason that AIDS is wiping out Africans at an alarming rate is because to suggest to African men that they should wear a condom for safety is a complete affront to their cultural heritage. In a farming community, the more children that you have, the more workers you have on the farm. Using a condom, to them, is one of the most vile things you could do.

So educating Africans about protecting themselves from the AIDS virus is incredibly difficult. Add to that the fact that many of the Africans are dying in their thirties and fourties, and you've got an agricultural crises of biblical proportions. Knowledge passed down for thousands of years, from generation to generation is being wiped out, because there's no "older generation" left to teach the children.

So, please, before you start blaming African women, educate yourself Dipstick. Then we'll talk.

Moby... One would think you are a paid apologist, spin doctor or lobbyist for homosexual advocates.

The figures for IV drug users has declined over the years. Compare them over time since they started keeping records of AIDS.

Another thing regarding the CDC... I have less and less trust in this agency as time goes by. They have become a highly politicized government agency instead of a first line defense in protecting the public from disease. They waste taxpayer dollars and vital funds from their budget studying the effects of gun violence. This is in no way related to disease. It is just a clear attempt to jump into the gun control issue and remove 2nd Amendment rights. They are also pushing the Model State Emergency Health Powers Act. This is a totalitarian type system of control that would usurp the power of all local governments in the event of a bioterror attack. It would give the CDC and HHS the authority to even jail citizens who refused to accept a vaccination or submit DNA. Also for some perverse agenda driven reason they wrote into this bill the right to confiscate your firearms and shut down all dealers. WTF is with that? Sound like a medical/disease agency to you?. The CDC has also for a number of years refused to awknowledge the know existing links between abortion and breast cancer. Why? For political reasons of course. I have no doubt that they are playing games with figures relating to AIDS and homosexual practices. This agency puts political agendas before public safety.

Your attempt to compare gay bath houses with whore houses in Nevada is totally ridiculous. You are so desirous of making homos look like straights it is beyond sickening.

You want recent data relating to gay promiscuity. It is hard to find because it's not PC and it offends people like you who love the gays. I do remember reading about a Dutch study that was released a while back. The results were alarming and no American press outlet ran with the story. I don't have time to search for the story now.

I'm sure there are plenty of bisexual men out there. Someone has to be infecting all these women. They are not infecting each other.

You say you have gay friends who are not promiscuous. How do you know? You asked them. If you are a straight guy what makes you think they would tell you the truth? How do you wind up with gay friends anyway? I couldn't be friends with anyone who didn't share similar values. The only exceptions I could see if it was someone you knew since childhood or something then all of a sudden tells you they are gay as an adult. Even then mosts guys would back off on the friendship somewhat. That would be a normal reaction. Are you sure you didn't mean acquaintances such as people you have to work with or whatever? Straight guys just don't make friends with gay people. If there is any friendship on some level it is always based on something external like a work relationship or a maybe they are neighbors or something like that.

You remind me of people who used to think it was chic to say "I have black friends". Only now the PC chic thing for liberals is to say you have gay friends. What do you do... tape "Will and Grace" for them when they are running late from the bath house or something. Sorry not buying it.

Do a little research on the sexual culture over there before you start the standard lefty insults.

Yeah ... we all know they refuse to use condoms over there, but most African societies have a "sex on demand" type culture.

It is ignorant of YOU to assume I meant it is the fault of thier women. It is the mens fault. They are the ones who keep the women sexually subjugated.

It's people who think like you is the main reason AIDS in Africa will never get any better. You never want to admit aspects of any 3rd world culture could be harmful to thier own people. It's the truth. Check it out before you start shoveling your shit.

Spin, spin, spin...

Ok, you've said that I'm the reason that AIDS in Africa will not get any better. What is your solution? Or are you just pointing fingers, like so many Conservatives do, without giving any decent answers to the problem?

I thought my comment towards your comment about homosexuals well deserved. By impling that all homosexuals spread diease, you very clearly show ignorance you're famous for.

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Are you going to tell everyone out there in XOC Land that homos do not spread any diseases? Is that the statement you are making? A simple yes or no to both questions will suffice.

Not all homosexuals have dieases, and straight people can spread HIV/AIDS too you know. Your hatered towards gays is further proof that you're

yourself.

Is that your big reply? Spin, Spin...

I did'nt say YOU were the problem. I said THINKING LIKE YOURS is the problem.

There is no solution to the African AIDS problem. Certainly not from anyone in the West. The only solution will have to come from the African people themselves. If they don't change aspects of thier culture and lifestyle, they are doomed for extinction. When they've had enough of the death and suffering they will be forced to change.

By the way... you forgot to mention the pathetic political governments on the African continent in your tirade. All are corrupt governments and petty dictatorships that don't give two shits about thier own people.

So, you admit you don't have any solutions. You only point out the problems. This is why I can't stand arguing with you.

You don't think they've had enough of it already? Look, they don't realize that they're the cause of their own suffering. They haven't changed the way they live in thousands of years. These are tribespeople. Even the more upscale ones in places like Kenya, South Africa, and Malawi are STILL very much people of the earth.
You also forget that they are VERY wary of anything western, thanks to occupations by the British and other "Western" civilizations. So whatever we educate them with, comes with that stigmatism.

Your opinions are very much that of someone who has sat on his fat ass in the US without venturing out, educating himself about how the rest of the world lives.

Another conservative tactic you seem to like to use, is when you're argued into a corner, you change the subject. Nice try, but I won't get sucked into it.

Why is it ridiculous? You think single guys are the only ones visiting them?

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You want recent data relating to gay promiscuity. It is hard to find because it's not PC and it offends people like you who love the gays. I do remember reading about a Dutch study that was released a while back. The results were alarming and no American press outlet ran with the story. I don't have time to search for the story now.

And comparing Europe to the US is ridiculous, too. Everyone knows Europe is a much more open, tolerant society.

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I'm sure there are plenty of bisexual men out there. Someone has to be infecting all these women. They are not infecting each other.

So if Magic Johnson's wife got it from him, does that make Magic a bisexual?

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You say you have gay friends who are not promiscuous. How do you know? You asked them. If you are a straight guy what makes you think they would tell you the truth?

Because I happen to be a friend, not an adversary. I do not condemn them for being gay. They know they can trust me.

Example? One couple has been together since high school. About 12 years.

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How do you wind up with gay friends anyway?

Met a number of them in high school, met a number of them in college, and have met a few at work.

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I couldn't be friends with anyone who didn't share similar values.

Well, that's just sad. There are a number of people in MAXC that I'm sure I am FAR away from sharing similar values. I still consider them friends.

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The only exceptions I could see if it was someone you knew since childhood or something then all of a sudden tells you they are gay as an adult. Even then mosts guys would back off on the friendship somewhat. That would be a normal reaction. Are you sure you didn't mean acquaintances such as people you have to work with or whatever?

Again...sad. If someone you knew since childhood, who you knew well, told you they were gay, you'd back off on the friendship? Some friend you are. Would it ever occur to you that maybe they felt like they could trust you? And now you have completely blown that out of the water.

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Straight guys just don't make friends with gay people.

As I don't go asking people if they are gay the first time I meet them, it's a non-issue. I don't go searching for gay people to befriend. If I happen to be friends with them (be it 20 years or 2 weeks) and then find out they are gay...so what? Doesn't change them one iota.

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If there is any friendship on some level it is always based on something external like a work relationship or a maybe they are neighbors or something like that.

Or a friend of a friend, or whatever. Work, neighbors, church and school are not the only way to meet people.

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You remind me of people who used to think it was chic to say "I have black friends". Only now the PC chic thing for liberals is to say you have gay friends. What do you do... tape "Will and Grace" for them when they are running late from the bath house or something. Sorry not buying it.

Well, whatever. I don't go around telling people, "hey, I have gay friends!" The point is, I don't give a shit whether they are or not. It doesn't affect me or my life whatsoever.

Yeah, I tape "Will and Grace" for them....well, except for the Log Cabin group... I tape Sean Hannity for them. :rolleyes:

Yes there is, and it will come from the west, it's called a vaccine. The more money/time thats put towards this effort, the sooner it will come.

When are you going to stop being such an asshole. You debate and argue like some little kid. Why didn't you say in caps "I WIN".

Grow up and talk like an adult. I clearly said any solution will have to come from them by changing themselves. Unless Sean's remark about a vaccine comes along (which I doubt anytime soon) there is nothing we can do.

What's your solution since you are such a bigshot liberal know it all?

jeez I hope so Sean. Thats IF the virus doesnt continue to mutate.

Once they isolate a large enough portion of the protein coat that doesn't mutate by more than 80%, or discover a way to safely attenuate the virus, we'll have the answer.

Just wanted to point out...

Sickle Cell Anemia is a great example, so is pseudofolliculitis barbae.

Different races are no so much anatomicly different as they are geneticly different. This then exposes them to different diseases based on these genetic factors.

EDUCATION. Beat it into their heads. Why do you think that Western countries aren't having the explosion that is being seen in Africa? Because we've found ways, if not to prevent it completly, then at least slow down it's path of destruction. Without education, Africa is going to be wiped out.

So, education. There is my answer. I'm still waiting for yours.